My official RaceChip thread -

[HBEcoBeaST]

Yep, i saw 3 of them on the way to pick up groceries today..... (insert sarcasm emote). Really guys, these bell curve extremes are true for sure but that's not me. This is my daily driver only and i gas it now and then for fun and that's about it. I mean should i really worry about blowing a piston ring on city roads heading to the market?

And in the very near future i'll be adding a larger FMIC to reduce the chances even further. Seems like mass hysteria here.

you saw 3 supercharged 4.7L tundras running superchips? I am not sure what you're trying to say. Honestly I am just trying to stop you from making the false assumption that this RaceChip is better or safer than an AP in any way. And I'm trying to get you to understand how a 'chip' works vs the AP

 

[Clint Beastwood]

Yep, i saw 3 of them on the way to pick up groceries today..... (insert sarcasm emote). Really guys, these bell curve extremes are true for sure but that's not me. This is my daily driver only and i gas it now and then for fun and that's about it. I mean should i really worry about blowing a piston ring on city roads heading to the market?

And in the very near future i'll be adding a larger FMIC to reduce the chances even further. Seems like mass hysteria here.

At least do the intercooler first. Tame that impulsive streak and do it as safely as possible if you insist on doing the racechip.

Impulsive decisions are rarely good decisions. We all understand the desire to do something *right now*, but you have to be smart. Knowing how the chip works, you can partially mitigate the added “blind spot” danger created by modifying sensor data by having your intake charge properly cooled.

At the end of the day, you’d probably be happiest with one of those throttle modification boxes that make the throttle “snappier”, that’ll make a bigger difference to driving “feel” than 20hp will.

 

[TalkToTheFiST]

I'm interested to see how this turns out, we shouldn't discount innovation just because some people "know" it will end poorly. Try it and see but most importantly report back how it goes. Talktothefist is willing to put up with the risk, I don't understand why so many people are trying to dissuade him. Worst that can possibly happen is we get a useful data point on whether Ford will warranty his engine or turbo.

I'd like to see more testing of fringe ideas instead of just following what other people have done. If the chip works out well, maybe the next step could be twin charging

I agree and i find it odd that here of all places so many are against testing things out. I have talked to a few people recently about maybe modding my car engine, in general, and they looked at me like i was crazy. To "regular" people not into auto, they think everybody here is crazy. And to be honest, as safe as tuners try to be, it's still adding risk to our cars to change the software at all.

This is a culture that's used to taking a calculated risk for potential reward, im doing the same thing just on a path less traveled. But im excited, if my car goes boom im more than willing to tell everybody and i'll be the first to say i should have listened. But if it works, i want people to know that too.

 

[TalkToTheFiST]

Buddy you need to learn how these chips work. It isn't magic, they tell your ECU that it's creating LESS boost to force your turbo to produce more. They tell your motor it's actually taking in a different amount of air and fuel than it is in order to force it to inject more. It also tells your motor it's running cooler and smoother than it actually is to prevent the ECU from pulling power. The built in safety measures of the ECU kick in when certain boost targets, temperatures and power figures are met, but they won't kick in if the chip is telling the sensors everything is OK when it isn't. To get around this, most "chips" run a pretty conservative change which nets some gains, but nowhere close to what they are claiming. Notice every power gain they give has an asterisk citing it's the *target* goal and that these numbers aren't guaranteed.

Yes these 'chips' will not void your warranty if you take it off since all the ECU will record will be normal running information since the chip fools your car into thinking it's running normal when it's not. THis is what makes the chips dangerous because the car is adjusting for parameters that are not reality.

An AP reflashes your entire ECU and runs a different program using the actual data from the sensors with newly set parameters. The engine's safety parameters are changed, but still there and they will kick in if things go south. The engine is still monitored in real time by the sensors and the ecu adjusts according to actual conditions. It's not simply "adding boost" or "adding timing", it's running a completely different tune and all parameters are adjusted accordingly. It's not fooling your motor into creating more power like a chip is, it's running more efficiently and effectively.

If $250 is your budget and you NEED your warranty, so be it. Understand how these chips work and an AP are entirely different. And please don't think all these power claims RaceChips makes are true and don't believe it is 'safer' for your motor. This is simply not true for the reasons stated above.

Where are you getting the part about the chip telling my ECU it's running cooler? I have looked over the installation manual (as you can on their site) as well as several installation how to videos and there are only two sensors it ties into on the FIST, one is the turbo boost pressure sensor and the other is the manifold absolute pressure sensor. Neither of these AFAIK measure temp so what are you basing this claim off of?

This isn't the first time this claim has been made in this thread. If people here are technically, mechanically educated on the workings of our EB engines, can somebody please show me exactly what part of the race chip affects the temp readings of the ECU? I have also watched and read explanations from the company engineers as well and they have not once mentioned altering temp readings. Anybody able to explain this? If not lets stop making false claims.

As for the warranty that's another benefit. I will get my FMIC later this year but no telling when i catch an AP at a good price, it won't be before i get my FMIC. So at best towards the end of 2019, who knows. And i may put another 10k on my engine by the time i get one, it will be nice to know my warranty holds in the meantime while im already getting a power bump.

 

[TalkToTheFiST]

What I'm curious about is how the warranty holds up with this. I understand that it's a piggyback and it's technically just sending different signals to the ECM or whatever. But, say your turbo blows and you bring it in under warranty... wouldn't Ford be able to see that the ECM was registering more boost than it should be? OR, does it trick the ECM into thinking it's at like 20 psi when it's really at 24 psi (or whatever). Is that how it works? It just seems like there would be some way to tell from the ECM that it was run beyond the factory limits

But it won't be registering more boost, that's the point of the chip. If the ECU knew there was more boost in the first place, it wouldn't be overboosting it. If there was a way for the ECM to know the real value, the chip wouldn't work. That's how it works, it hides the real pressure values and reports a slightly lower value and the ECU compensates by adding boost. It has no idea the real readings, so if by some chance i do have an engine issue caused by the chip, once i take it off, nobody knew. That's one of the benefits over actual tunes.

But as i explained in my last post i think this heat destruction theory is false. There is nothing i can find anywhere in explanations or in the manual that mentions altering the temp values the ECU sees, it only has two sensor inputs and both are for pressure only. I think this heat issue is something somebody just decided to toss into the discussion for no reason.

The car still knows the true temps just like when you use an AP with extra boost. If temps get too high, it cuts boost, which we call heat soak right? Why is the new guy having to sort out the technical facts on this forum guys? Sheesh. Again if im wrong and somebody can find the actual mechanism the chip uses to alter ECU temp values i will apologize immediately, but i have been looking and see nothing of the sort.

 

[TalkToTheFiST]

you saw 3 supercharged 4.7L tundras running superchips? I am not sure what you're trying to say. Honestly I am just trying to stop you from making the false assumption that this RaceChip is better or safer than an AP in any way. And I'm trying to get you to understand how a 'chip' works vs the AP

LOL I was just goofing around about the tundras. I hear you about the safety thing, im not saying they are safer i just don't think there's much difference between the two. 2 or 3 mo tops and i will my FMIC too keeping heat down even more.

As for how a chip works maybe you can offer some tech information. People keep saying it alters the temp readings of the ECU, can you explain how? There's two sensors the chip ties into, where is it altering the heat values the ECU sees? I could see the AP and a tune being able to alter this or rewrite the safety limits which in theory could make them less safe, but this race chip does neither. It only alters pressure readings to coax the ECU into producing more boost. If im wrong please show me as i prefer to know the truth.

 

[HBEcoBeaST]

At least do the intercooler first. Tame that impulsive streak and do it as safely as possible if you insist on doing the racechip.

Impulsive decisions are rarely good decisions.

Where are you getting the part about the chip telling my ECU it's running cooler? I have looked over the installation manual (as you can on their site) as well as several installation how to videos and there are only two sensors it ties into on the FIST, one is the turbo boost pressure sensor and the other is the manifold absolute pressure sensor. Neither of these AFAIK measure temp so what are you basing this claim off of?

This isn't the first time this claim has been made in this thread. If people here are technically, mechanically educated on the workings of our EB engines, can somebody please show me exactly what part of the race chip affects the temp readings of the ECU? I have also watched and read explanations from the company engineers as well and they have not once mentioned altering temp readings. Anybody able to explain this? If not lets stop making false claims.

As for the warranty that's another benefit. I will get my FMIC later this year but no telling when i catch an AP at a good price, it won't be before i get my FMIC. So at best towards the end of 2019, who knows. And i may put another 10k on my engine by the time i get one, it will be nice to know my warranty holds in the meantime while im already getting a power bump.

Just like how the AP 'guesses' oil temperature and power output by the data from other sensors than an actual Dyno or oil thermometer, the car ECU determines actual temperature based on pressure, air flow and boost temp provided by the sum of multiple sensors. Modifying any sensors affects how the motor percieves how it's running, so even if you are directly piggybacking only 2 sensors, it affects more than just what those sensors directly measure.

 

[TalkToTheFiST]

At least do the intercooler first. Tame that impulsive streak and do it as safely as possible if you insist on doing the racechip.

Impulsive decisions are rarely good decisions. We all understand the desire to do something *right now*, but you have to be smart. Knowing how the chip works, you can partially mitigate the added “blind spot” danger created by modifying sensor data by having your intake charge properly cooled.

At the end of the day, you’d probably be happiest with one of those throttle modification boxes that make the throttle “snappier”, that’ll make a bigger difference to driving “feel” than 20hp will.

I had looked at those too but i was under the impression an AP allows that alteration in a tune no? They have the one from RaceChip for $275 and im drawing the line at $250 getting put on a shelf in the end. If i weren't going for the AP i would probably get one, as well as the more powerful chip for $450. But not likely to happen as that will only get me to a claimed 250hp/277tq. I'd like to eventually push 300 and as i understand it, will have to get a new turbo for that.

 

[TalkToTheFiST]

Just like how the AP 'guesses' oil temperature and power output by the data from other sensors than an actual Dyno or oil thermometer, the car ECU determines actual temperature based on pressure, air flow and boost temp provided by the sum of multiple sensors. Modifying any sensors affects how the motor percieves how it's running, so even if you are directly piggybacking only 2 sensors, it affects more than just what those sensors directly measure.

So you're telling me they don't use actual temp sensors in these engines, that the temp is guessed by the ECU?

 

[HBEcoBeaST]

So you're telling me they don't use actual temp sensors in these engines, that the temp is guessed by the ECU?

There's multiple places an engine needs to know it's temperature(and other parameters) including inside the combustion chamber. There's no sensor directly inside the chamber. It calculates the needed values based on other sensors.

 

[jeffreylyon]

I had looked at those too but i was under the impression an AP allows that alteration in a tune no? They have the one from RaceChip for $275 and im drawing the line at $250 getting put on a shelf in the end. If i weren't going for the AP i would probably get one, as well as the more powerful chip for $450. But not likely to happen as that will only get me to a claimed 250hp/277tq. I'd like to eventually push 300 and as i understand it, will have to get a new turbo for that.

 

[jeff]

I had looked at those too but i was under the impression an AP allows that alteration in a tune no? They have the one from RaceChip for $275 and im drawing the line at $250 getting put on a shelf in the end. If i weren't going for the AP i would probably get one, as well as the more powerful chip for $450. But not likely to happen as that will only get me to a claimed 250hp/277tq. I'd like to eventually push 300 and as i understand it, will have to get a new turbo for that.

Again I am baffled that you believe, whether it's wheel or crank horsepower, that this RaceChip thing will get you 250hp...I try to be as helpful as possible to members of the forum here but I'm at the point where it feels like the twilight zone reading this stuff. All these posts and you still hold to these things no matter what we try to tell you, and very nicely I might add. The car stock is 180 at the wheels, dyno proven back in 2013...that's maybe 205 at the crank. I good custom tune with all the bolt-on hardware might get you to 220 crank, but likely less. And you still believe after 70+ posts here that this product will get you to 250???

Kenny Wang, 2016, fiestastforum.com, it's all there for those that remember.

I'm gonna quit reading these threads, I feel that our sincere attempts to save you money and save your car are being completely disregarded. I'm not saying this to insult you, and I wish you the best, but if you wonder why people bow out of your threads and quit trying to help, this is why.

 

[Dpro]

Ya I gave up it’s futile. Advice was taken in disregard . So why give it anymore.

 

[Spork1569]

Again I am baffled that you believe, whether it's wheel or crank horsepower, that this RaceChip thing will get you 250hp...I try to be as helpful as possible to members of the forum here but I'm at the point where it feels like the twilight zone reading this stuff. All these posts and you still hold to these things no matter what we try to tell you, and very nicely I might add. The car stock is 180 at the wheels, dyno proven back in 2013...that's maybe 205 at the crank. I good custom tune with all the bolt-on hardware might get you to 220 crank, but likely less. And you still believe after 70+ posts here that this product will get you to 250???

Kenny Wang, 2016, fiestastforum.com, it's all there for those that remember.

I'm gonna quit reading these threads, I feel that our sincere attempts to save you money and save your car are being completely disregarded. I'm not saying this to insult you, and I wish you the best, but if you wonder why people bow out of your threads and quit trying to help, this is why.

I'm curious about the Kenny Wang incident, tried searching but not much came up. Is this like another point in FiST forum history like the downfall of DHM?

 

[jeff]

I'm curious about the Kenny Wang incident, tried searching but not much came up. Is this like another point in FiST forum history like the downfall of DHM?

Yeah you won’t find any info on Kenny, when the forum switched formats a while back a bunch of archived stuff was lost.

Kenny Wang was a user who epitomized the attitude of “I don’t know the difference between Chinese chicken and Swedish meatballs but let me tell you a thing or two, pal” and then argued incessantly with anyone who tried to offer advice.

His name became synonymous with anyone who expressed that sort of presence. My wife even tells me about the Kenny Wangs on her various social media/forums, the name has become quite useful in our household. It can even be used as a verb, like “Yeah this guy at the counter kept Kenny Wanging, I just wanted to pay my bill and get the hell out of there.”

Long live....KENNY WANG!!!!

 

[Hypergram]

Yeah you won’t find any info on Kenny, when the forum switched formats a while back a bunch of archived stuff was lost.

Kenny Wang was a user who epitomized the attitude of “I don’t know the difference between Chinese chicken and Swedish meatballs but let me tell you a thing or two, pal” and then argued incessantly with anyone who tried to offer advice.

His name became synonymous with anyone who expressed that sort of presence. My wife even tells me about the Kenny Wangs on her various social media/forums, the name has become quite useful in our household. It can even be used as a verb, like “Yeah this guy at the counter kept Kenny Wanging, I just wanted to pay my bill and get the hell out of there.”

Long live....KENNY WANG!!!!

Wow, that's a great story to hear lol. Funny to hear that a single person on a forum can become such a legend, even for the wrong reasons.

 

[Spork1569]

Yeah you won’t find any info on Kenny, when the forum switched formats a while back a bunch of archived stuff was lost.

Kenny Wang was a user who epitomized the attitude of “I don’t know the difference between Chinese chicken and Swedish meatballs but let me tell you a thing or two, pal” and then argued incessantly with anyone who tried to offer advice.

His name became synonymous with anyone who expressed that sort of presence. My wife even tells me about the Kenny Wangs on her various social media/forums, the name has become quite useful in our household. It can even be used as a verb, like “Yeah this guy at the counter kept Kenny Wanging, I just wanted to pay my bill and get the hell out of there.”

Long live....KENNY WANG!!!!

Thanks for the history lesson, time to make use of the phrase on the forums now lol.

Guess there will be a few incidents we newbies will never know from the earlier years of the car.

 

[TalkToTheFiST]

[

Yeah you won’t find any info on Kenny, when the forum switched formats a while back a bunch of archived stuff was lost.

Kenny Wang was a user who epitomized the attitude of “I don’t know the difference between Chinese chicken and Swedish meatballs but let me tell you a thing or two, pal” and then argued incessantly with anyone who tried to offer advice.

His name became synonymous with anyone who expressed that sort of presence. My wife even tells me about the Kenny Wangs on her various social media/forums, the name has become quite useful in our household. It can even be used as a verb, like “Yeah this guy at the counter kept Kenny Wanging, I just wanted to pay my bill and get the hell out of there.”

Long live....KENNY WANG!!!!

So first you insult me with chicken and meatballs in this comparison, then you imply im arguing incessantly with everybody offering advice? Guess what Mr Know it all, if you had used this item yourself on your FIST and actually had something to say that was factual, i might listen to you.

Instead you end up butt hurt bc somebody new doesn't take your every word of advice like the gospel. I've been into photography for nearly a decade as a high level enthusiast, been a member of a camera forum for 8 years and we have plenty of people like you too. People who think they know everything about everything just bc they have a little info about something.

You've never used a RaceChip on any car let alone a FIST so how does your experience with APs give me anything real to work with? It doesn't. Feel free to take a hike out of this thread and if the chip works like i expect and im offering my experiences with it in the future, feel free to pass up those threads too.

I've been polite this entire time and gave you time to take the high road and return the favor. Whatever dude, go fly a kite. To the rest of the people who agree or disagree with my choices and have been cordial i appreciate your input and hope to discuss more with you in the future.

 

[Spork1569]

[




So first you insult me with chicken and meatballs in this comparison, then you imply im arguing incessantly with everybody offering advice? Guess what Mr Know it all, if you had used this item yourself on your FIST and actually had something to say that was factual, i might listen to you.

Instead you end up butt hurt bc somebody new doesn't take your every word of advice like the gospel. I've been into photography for nearly a decade as a high level enthusiast, been a member of a camera forum for 8 years and we have plenty of people like you too. People who think they know everything about everything just bc they have a little info about something.

You've never used a RaceChip on any car let alone a FIST so how does your experience with APs give me anything real to work with? It doesn't. Feel free to take a hike out of this thread and if the chip works like i expect and im offering my experiences with it in the future, feel free to pass up those threads too.

I've been polite this entire time and gave you time to take the high road and return the favor. Whatever dude, go fly a kite. To the rest of the people who agree or disagree with my choices and have been cordial i appreciate your input and hope to discuss more with you in the future.

Not sure if it was directed at you as he was just telling a tale from a while ago in this forum.

Jeff's been one of the few longtime members who's still around despite pretty much finishing his build a while ago, and produced a good bit of helpful content you may see as you scour the forums.

I think he and a lot of other posters are just upset because some have been modding cars for a while and are giving advice regarding said race chips, as the technology has been around and while no one has bought a chip for this car specifically, they have had similar experience on other platforms. In the end like others have said it's your money and you can do with it what you wish, but some don't want to keep repeating the same info only to fall on deaf ears.

I can understand the frustration from both sides and in the end wish you luck in your modding endeavors.

 

[Hypergram]

Not sure if it was directed at you as he was just telling a tale from a while ago in this forum.

Jeff's been one of the few longtime members who's still around despite pretty much finishing his build a while ago, and produced a good bit of helpful content you may see as you scour the forums.

I think he and a lot of other posters are just upset because some have been modding cars for a while and are giving advice regarding said race chips, as the technology has been around and while no one has bought a chip for this car specifically, they have had similar experience on other platforms. In the end like others have said it's your money and you can do with it what you wish, but some don't want to keep repeating the same info only to fall on deaf ears.

I can understand the frustration from both sides and in the end wish you luck in your modding endeavors.

This... This is probably the nicest comment on this whole thread lol.