Psa do not use motul in your fiesta st

[HardBoiledEgg]

I used the standard Motorcraft fluid for about 70k then switched to Ravenol as a last ditch effort to see if it would cure the "whine". I had the whining sound since around 15-20k. It was very subtle and thought it was normal sounding as it did not increase in sound level and operated fine with no issues. Eventually the sound did start to increase in volume over time and decided to try the Ravenol. A few thousand miles later the whine was more like a grinding sound, also like marbles bouncing around. Noise was under load and went away if clutch was pressed in. Finally it was noise no matter what and got it to the shop before it stranded me. I had the trans and everything transmission related replaced. I used about 1.7 until I tried the Ravenol and just did the full 2.

I'm with you. But I'm really anal about cars. And it let's me sleep at night thinking it's the fluid. Cause to me if a bearing has oil it's not going out. But what do I know.

 

[HardBoiledEgg]

I work at Ford, the stock fluid cost almost as much as the aftermarket stuff we use. Idk about free

 

[danbfree]

I work at Ford, the stock fluid cost almost as much as the aftermarket stuff we use. Idk about free

I know I was implying they made a bad choice to go with DCT fluid, even if it's a dry clutch system and probably a similar 6 speed gearbox included. I just don't understand why such crappy watery stuff drained out that really gave a bad impression. I'm also thinking these gearboxes, like the suspension, may take 15k to really fully break in possibly, I just know for sure that switching to Ravenol at 12k and now at 18k my gear box feel worlds better compared to the first 12k on OEM fluid.

 

[koozy]

Redline DUAL CLUTCH TRANS FLUID ftw.

 

[tyhackman15]

Yeah, I actually actively seek out lighter than factory shift knobs, if that is a possibility (but then I've owned very few cable shifted, sport compacts/imports before this ride, so ).

Running the crazy light wood nardi on my miata, you can literally feel everything that happens during a shift. It's not fun when the trans is cold, but once it's warm you can't beat it.

 

[jmrtsus]

As to the cost of these magic fluids that either fix or destroy your transmission keep this in mind. "It is hard as hell to get the oil out of that snake!" Heard that 50 years ago.......little has changed. It was from an independent test of oil additives like STP and Wynn if I remember correctly. None showed any reduction in wear.

Every lubrication producer or repackager will tell you they are the best, same with dish soaps, toilet paper, pain relievers or any other product. Engine oil is easy to research, there are actual independent labs that can test oils. But keep this in mind, if XYZ oil pays them to test their oil they know that XYZ wants good ad copy so they do tests and report the highlights that support what the customer is paying for. I prefer Fed labs. As to transmission fluids for our car I know of no real tests that have been done. So all we have is anecdotal information. Like I said above some love a brand and others damn the same brand. There is just not enough money in these fluids to get any real tests done. We have a fluid that has no change intervals. I suspect most of our cars will go to the junkyards with the original fill.

The last I checked no TSB has been issued on the fill levels unless I have missed it in looking for one. All I found was a mention of 3rd gear problems and Ford fix for the 2014 Fusion/Fiesta B6. Does anyone have knowledge of this fluid level issue that is said to be destroying transmissions being addressed by Ford? I would have thought by now there would be something out there with the many, many thousands of our transmissions in service. But am willing to admit I may have missed it. I want to change my fluid, but what/how much to use is not very clear. Help us out if you know please!

 

[Ford ST]

Ravenol MTF-2 No one has anything negative to say about it.

The level is supposed to be 1 inch below the fill hole.
Everyone has been happy with a full 2L.
I know overfilling a manual transmission can't do any harm other than make it leak somewhere. No reported leaks from using 2L, vs the 1.7L Ford spec.

If you are concerned about moving away from factory fluids just use factory fluid at 1.7L. The fact no one has anything negative to say about using 2L speaks for itself to me.

Sent from my LG-LS997 using Tapatalk

 

[FiSTerMr]

There is no specific tsb associated directly with fluid level; however, it was part of another tsb that dealt with axle/trans noise. The remedy was to fill to 2+ liters. There is a member on here that was specifically told this by a service tech when his trans was being replaced.

*Also, measuring the fluid amount by using the physical spec below fill hole (?mm, don't remember offhand), which is in the actual factory service manual, it measures out to just over 2 liters.
The owners manual that comes with our car, just states fluid specs, which is inconsistent with actual service tech info as stated above.

Edit: As noted by "Ford ST", the extra fluid level, even if over than what is intended, would not harm anything. I would much rather be a bit over than under!

 

[jmrtsus]

There is no specific tsb associated directly with fluid level; however, it was part of another tsb that dealt with axle/trans noise. The remedy was to fill to 2+ liters. There is a member on here that was specifically told this by a service tech when his trans was being replaced.

*Also, measuring the fluid amount by using the physical spec below fill hole (?mm, don't remember offhand), which is in the actual factory service manual, it measures out to just over 2 liters.
The owners manual that comes with our car, just states fluid specs, which is inconsistent with actual service tech info as stated above.

Edit: As noted by "Ford ST", the extra fluid level, even if over than what is intended, would not harm anything. I would much rather be a bit over than under!

Thanks for the info but I am trying to find out if anyone has actually SEEN anything on it from Ford as I can't find anything other that the 2014 3rd gear issue on the Ford or Magna(Getrag) sites. I hear much of the "a guy that knows a guy said" but a search of Ford TSB's show nothing on fill levels for the B6 in any Ford vehicle that I can find. I understand what is said and done on the Forum but find it strange it is not addressed by Ford in writing for their service staff if it is indeed an issue. I am hopeful someone here will have a Ford contact that may can search data the internet is not allowed access.

 

[FiSTerMr]

Thanks for the info but I am trying to find out if anyone has actually SEEN anything on it from Ford as I can't find anything other that the 2014 3rd gear issue on the Ford or Magna(Getrag) sites. I hear much of the "a guy that knows a guy said" but a search of Ford TSB's show nothing on fill levels for the B6 in any Ford vehicle that I can find. I understand what is said and done on the Forum but find it strange it is not addressed by Ford in writing for their service staff if it is indeed an issue. I am hopeful someone here will have a Ford contact that may can search data the internet is not allowed access.

It is physically part of another tsb, aside from member heresay. I don't know the tsb number, but if you search google, threads will come up forum this forum and the other (.org). Search for "fiesta st axle noise" or trans noise, Tsb.... Axle clack noise....

 

[jmrtsus]

It is physically part of another tsb, aside from member heresay. I don't know the tsb number, but if you search google, threads will come up forum this forum and the other (.org). Search for "fiesta st axle noise" or trans noise, Tsb.... Axle clack noise....

Thanks for your help, all that is there is the one I referenced above that changed the axle and bearings on very early 2014 production, the "fix" part number is discontinued so no other details on it and also says to me a change in production parts (not fluid levels) cured the problem since 2014. Since it was a Fusion and Fiesta "fix" the tech may have been looking at the Fusion fill level on the instructions. It was 2014 only. So I think if Ford changed it we would have known by now.

My concern is less with what to use but how much. The difference is about 18% more fluid. The question becomes why did Ford not simply spec 2.0L or issue an addendum to the owners manual and TSB if 1.7 is incorrect? Is the 1.7 L level to keep internal pressure down due to heat induced fluid expansion by providing more air space? Does the additional fluid cause a temp increase due to internal friction that may affect long term reliability of the bearings? Just because a transmission CAN hold more fluid does not imply it is good to do so.
Like others it is new to me to see basically ATF fluid in a manual so I am concerned about longevity as this car will not leave the family. So still looking for answers.

 

[M-Sport fan]

Redline DUAL CLUTCH TRANS FLUID ftw.

Most likely one of THE most shear-proof, 'stout' DCTF fluids out there, going by the base stocks and add packs which they tend to use in their formulations.

 

[koozy]

Here’s a novel thought regarding the fluid preferences and/if it may causing gearbox issues. It may not be the fluid at all, but a bad batch/out of spec gearboxes to begin with from the factory. It’s not unheard of.

IMO any quality 75-85W GL4 fluid should suffice regardless if it meets exact Ford specs or not. People get so fixed on specs and then put in and throw on other junk on their car. Logic and common sense may have gone out the window.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[TyphoonFiST]

Ravenol MTF-2 No one has anything negative to say about it.

The level is supposed to be 1 inch below the fill hole.
Everyone has been happy with a full 2L.
I know overfilling a manual transmission can't do any harm other than make it leak somewhere. No reported leaks from using 2L, vs the 1.7L Ford spec.

If you are concerned about moving away from factory fluids just use factory fluid at 1.7L. The fact no one has anything negative to say about using 2L speaks for itself to me.

Sent from my LG-LS997 using Tapatalk

My New Trans came from Ford with alittle over 2L in it after I had it replaced due to a bearing failure at I think it was 27k....been rolling ravenol since 30k....Best fluid Replacement I have done for the FiST that could be actually felt immediately after driving. You can see the Amount I took out in my 75w80 Ravenol thread also.

Sent from my SM-N950U1 using Tapatalk

 

[FiSTerMr]

Thanks for your help, all that is there is the one I referenced above that changed the axle and bearings on very early 2014 production, the "fix" part number is discontinued so no other details on it and also says to me a change in production parts (not fluid levels) cured the problem since 2014. Since it was a Fusion and Fiesta "fix" the tech may have been looking at the Fusion fill level on the instructions. It was 2014 only. So I think if Ford changed it we would have known by now.

My concern is less with what to use but how much. The difference is about 18% more fluid. The question becomes why did Ford not simply spec 2.0L or issue an addendum to the owners manual and TSB if 1.7 is incorrect? Is the 1.7 L level to keep internal pressure down due to heat induced fluid expansion by providing more air space? Does the additional fluid cause a temp increase due to internal friction that may affect long term reliability of the bearings? Just because a transmission CAN hold more fluid does not imply it is good to do so.
Like others it is new to me to see basically ATF fluid in a manual so I am concerned about longevity as this car will not leave the family. So still looking for answers.

You sound exactly like me on another thread, I had the same concerns about putting 2L in, I even mentioned the 18% difference. There's a couple of big threads about this very subject , I don't know if you read them yet. The big thread 36 pgs long, it talks all about it (mostly 3/4 of the way).

As far as the TSB, I will do some digging, my "google-fu" is pretty decent. I had a bunch of stuff bookmarked a few months ago, but I think I cleared them out.

As for putting ATF in a manual transmission, it's not a new thing, my 91 Mustang GT specified ATF in the T-5 gearbox. That trans never had any issues on it.

My New Trans came from Ford with alittle over 2L in it after I had it replaced due to a bearing failure at I think it was 27k....

Thank you. You were the "forum member" I referred to a few posts back. Specifically about fluid levels.

 

[vixenlotus]

I put in one jug of Motul DCTF and one of the 300. i like the idea of balancing the 2 to make a viscosity slightly greater than the stock fluid. The car feels amazing. it could be just the ticket.

 

[danbfree]

You sound exactly like me on another thread, I had the same concerns about putting 2L in, I even mentioned the 18% difference. There's a couple of big threads about this very subject , I don't know if you read them yet. The big thread 36 pgs long, it talks all about it (mostly 3/4 of the way).

As far as the TSB, I will do some digging, my "google-fu" is pretty decent. I had a bunch of stuff bookmarked a few months ago, but I think I cleared them out.

As for putting ATF in a manual transmission, it's not a new thing, my 91 Mustang GT specified ATF in the T-5 gearbox. That trans never had any issues on it.




Thank you. You were the "forum member" I referred to a few posts back. Specifically about fluid levels.

FYI, that was an old post you quoted, there absolutely is a TSB for '16-'17 cars as well for half shafts and part of the solution is using 2L of fluid. The previous 5 speed took 2.1L so it appears to either an error on Ford's part or they felt they could get 0.25 MPG better by going with less, all indication are the 2-2.1L is the actual proper amount. No matter what fluid you use, as long as it's GL-4 or approved DCT, the 2L amount is definitely a certainty.

 

[Erbarry]

Haven’t read through the thread yet but I just had my tranny replaced, under warranty, at 54k miles. I switched over to Motul DCTF 1.6L somewhere between 10-15k so it’s been it the tranny for about 40k. Started off with a winding noise, then a constant rattle on acceleration. From the time I heard the winding noise, to the rattling and taking it to Ford was within 1500 miles. Car drove fine and shifted fine it was just noisy. Before taking it to ford I drained the fluid and had a lot of metal dust, the fluid looked like glittery paint.

The following items where reported worn on Fords report due too much metal contamination thru out tranny:
Case
Input rear bearing
Front input shaft bearing
Rear output shaft bearing
Front output shaft bearing
Output 6th gear
Input shaft 6th gear
Both differential bearings
Both reverse gear shaft bearings
Final gear
Reverse gear
Syncronizers
Blocking ring

 

[FiSTerMr]

FYI, that was an old post you quoted, there absolutely is a TSB for '16-'17 cars as well for half shafts and part of the solution is using 2L of fluid. The previous 5 speed took 2.1L so it appears to either an error on Ford's part or they felt they could get 0.25 MPG better by going with less, all indication are the 2-2.1L is the actual proper amount. No matter what fluid you use, as long as it's GL-4 or approved DCT, the 2L amount is definitely a certainty.

You don't need to convince me, it's the other member, "jmrtsus", that was doubting it.
I am running 2 liters myself.


[emoji1303]

 

[FiSTerMr]

Haven’t read through the thread yet but I just had my tranny replaced, under warranty, at 54k miles. I switched over to Motul DCTF 1.6L somewhere between 10-15k so it’s been it the tranny for about 40k. Started off with a winding noise, then a constant rattle on acceleration. From the time I heard the winding noise, to the rattling and taking it to Ford was within 1500 miles. Car drove fine and shifted fine it was just noisy. Before taking it to ford I drained the fluid and had a lot of metal dust, the fluid looked like glittery paint.

The following items where reported worn on Fords report due too much metal contamination thru out tranny:
Case
Input rear bearing
Front input shaft bearing
Rear output shaft bearing
Front output shaft bearing
Output 6th gear
Input shaft 6th gear
Both differential bearings
Both reverse gear shaft bearings
Final gear
Reverse gear
Syncronizers
Blocking ring

Wow, yeah at that point I guess it's hard to figure out what contaminated what, since everything now has metal in it.

Sorry to hear that happened, glad to hear Ford stepped up.

Perhaps 2 liters instead of 1.6 would've prevented the failure.