ATP Turbo upgrade

[re-rx7]

I know the FRP is at ~2300psi and increasing pressure means a new high pressure mechanical fuel pump (driven by the camshaft)... so it's definitely not an easy upgrade if required. I'm just not sold on the notion that it's required.

A tune plus much larger injectors means more fuel per injector pulse...

yes depending upon base fuel pressure. It gets to a point where the pump can't keep up.

Anyone ever ran a 100shot of nitrous ? Samething. Don't add a bottle.

So your saying add another pump, line and tank? Really? If your saying t off the existing fuel line then that just hurts base pressure that much more and atomization into a intake will change from inside the combustion chamber especially at that high of a fp.

Like I said adding fuel isn't that simple compared to older engines.

 

[Sourskittle]

$100 walbro "lift pump" and t-into the line from the tank to the High pressure pump. A walbro can supply enough volume for a 500hp motor, the high pressure pump just converts that to "high pressure".

 

[re-rx7]

$100 walbro "lift pump" and t-into the line from the tank to the High pressure pump. A walbro can supply enough volume for a 500hp motor, the high pressure pump just converts that to "high pressure".

That sounds very dangerous. Robbing fuel with a big pump from a line that feeds a very high pressure pump. Whatever suits you though.

 

[iso100]

But you're assuming that the high pressure pump is limited by feed pressure, not by it's ability to build pressure based on RPM. There's a limit to the amount of volume and pressure it can produce at various rpm's. I'm not certain any of us know that limit.

 

[RAAMaudio]

I was really excited about the GT series but the lack of bottom end leaves me wanting something different. Big numbers are great when in the situation to use them but as mentioned, power under the curve, real world use.....having less more often is better to me than having more I cannot always use. There are easy ways to show you can have more power with less peak power for most of your driving. Less bragging rights but that does not matter too much to me, to each his own, I am going for the widest power band I can get so the EFR 62/58 is the only thing I have found that gets me close but still not perfect, only displacement can cure that.

 

[Sourskittle]

And if your telling that your willing to bolt a 400whp turbo and supporting mods to your 1.6L but an intank fuel pump is too much, then I don't know what to say to that, lol

 

[iso100]

Who, me? Nope. Not willing to do either.

I just don't think a high pressure transfer pump will solve a fuel starvation issue in a positive displacement pump. It can only turn so fast and is locked in a 1:1 ratio with the camshaft.

 

[iso100]

Perhaps there are readily available bolt in pumps that have larger pistons for higher pressure and volume...

 

[re-rx7]

I was really excited about the GT series but the lack of bottom end leaves me wanting something different. Big numbers are great when in the situation to use them but as mentioned, power under the curve, real world use.....having less more often is better to me than having more I cannot always use. There are easy ways to show you can have more power with less peak power for most of your driving. Less bragging rights but that does not matter too much to me, to each his own, I am going for the widest power band I can get so the EFR 62/58 is the only thing I have found that gets me close but still not perfect, only displacement can cure that.

I agree with this 100%

And if your telling that your willing to bolt a 400whp turbo and supporting mods to your 1.6L but an intank fuel pump is too much, then I don't know what to say to that, lol

Yup. Your trying to go around what I said. Its not as simple as you think. Your gonna run line the length of the car and wire in a new pump the length of the car to ensure adequate voltage ect. Then pray everything works easily just as " a nitrous shot". As i recall You were saying it was gonna be super easy to add fuel if needed....and i quote
"What everyone doesn't reallize is that even if you maxed out the fuel system at 300whp, its not a big deal add more fuel still"

Who, me? Nope. Not willing to do either.

I just don't think a high pressure transfer pump will solve a fuel starvation issue in a positive displacement pump. It can only turn so fast and is locked in a 1:1 ratio with the camshaft.

I agree. You have to upgrade the pump. Thats not saying that a company may not step up and build one.

 

[Sourskittle]

Who, me? Nope. Not willing to do either.

I just don't think a high pressure transfer pump will solve a fuel starvation issue in a positive displacement pump. It can only turn so fast and is locked in a 1:1 ratio with the camshaft.

No, i agree with you there. I personally don't think that even at 350whp the hpfp is going to be an issue.

The stock in-tank pump maybe.

But I'm saying if you T into the stock fuel line ( before it goes into the hpfp and ramps to 30,000psi or what ever ), then fog in 50-100hp worth of fuel, your giving the motor enough fuel for 400-450whp assuming the stock hpfp and injectors are good for 350whp.

Also good news... Really big turbos have really big lag. That's actually a good thing for higher rpms fuel delivery. If your making 400whp at 7,000rpm, then the hpfp is turning 7,000rpm. It your making 400whp at 4500rpms ( which were not) then the pump is turning much slower and it would be hard for it to keep up.

 

[Sourskittle]

I'm not adding a new fuel pump or new wiring. Its simply replacing the stock in-tank pump.

 

[re-rx7]

I'm not adding a new fuel pump or new wiring. Its simply replacing the stock in-tank pump.

Oh for godsakes.

 

[iso100]

Where would you fog in though? In the plastic intake manifold? I believe GDI engines have very different combustion chambers and adding fuel in another method won't work. The fuel must be properly stratified.

 

[Sourskittle]

GDI engines can not run Nitrous or alcoy injection? No one tell the bmw 335i guys...

 

[Sourskittle]

Quick question. Not meant to be insulting, honestly.

Have either one of you guys ACTUALLY owned, driven, and installed a nitrous wet kit on your car before?
And not a carb'd car...
Just wondering.

 

[iso100]

"I believe"... I could be wrong. This is all hypothetical. We're wasting our time even discussing this. Apparently ATP has it working just fine...

 

[iso100]

I have not, but I know how they work.

 

[re-rx7]

Where would you fog in though? In the plastic intake manifold? I believe GDI engines have very different combustion chambers and adding fuel in another method won't work. The fuel must be properly stratified.

My fear is gasoline deposits on the back of valves that arent supposed to be there.

GDI engines can not run Nitrous or alcoy injection? No one tell the bmw 335i guys...

No one said that. Jesus your dense. Your talking like adding fuel in is gonna be a walk in the park. If this was the case the MAzda guys would be all over your idea rather than ponying up for a fuel pump ugrade. Just "fog" in some fuel is the dumbest thing ive ever heard for fuel enrichment. Im curious to as to where it would be fogged in. How you gonna control the fuel amount? a completely separate AFPR? Jesus why am i even having this conversation. Ive lost Iq points.

Quick question. Not meant to be insulting, honestly.

Have either one of you guys ACTUALLY owned, driven, and installed a nitrous wet kit on your car before?
And not a carb'd car...
Just wondering.

I had juice on my 5.0.. Ive built alot more powerful cars then you and I can build, tune a rotary so yes i have experience.

 

[iso100]

I'm with you on the fuel deposit concerns. It happens enough already without mucking with the fuel system.

 

[re-rx7]

I have not, but I know how they work.

Its simple he thinks he knows what he is talking about but what he is talking about is absolutely idiotic. To control the fuel he is "fogging" he will need a AFPR or some way of controlling whats going through that nozzle. Todays nitrous kits take about 2 hrs tops to install. I dont doubt one bit he was a SRT owner. The easiest way through all of this would be water/meth injection (which have their own kits for ratios and amount) and wait for fuel upgrades to be made.