STREET/'performance' alignment specs?

[M-Sport fan]

I have seen PLENTY of threads about radical/semi-radical autocross and/or track day alignment specs, but NONE on just good street alignment settings (unless I am looking in the wrong places??).

What are some good (albeit compromised), 'performance' specs for the street which will yield decent turn-in/response/etc. without totally killing off 200 tread wear tires in under 2K miles, and without turning the front's inside edges to slicks with a little straight highway driving?

Thanks in advance,

Dave H.

 

[berlow94]

Curious to hear more about people thoughts on this.

I specifically asked my dealer to equalize the caster and camber L/R on my car before delivery. (The increase passenger caster and camber to keep the car straight when you're on a curved road surface).

The tech told me they aren't allowed to align outside of factory spec...


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[M-Sport fan]

The tech told me they aren't allowed to align outside of factory spec..

Mine told me this same thing when I asked them to do settings which were still well WITHIN the 'factory spec' setting range (albeit to the far ends of it for some of the settings).

They refused to do this, EVEN with me offering to sign a waiver statement!

So, I have an appointment tomorrow at my local tuner shop to get this done, hence WHY I am asking.

 

[awwwww_shift]

I guess feel depends on driver for a lot of people, and suspension setups play a big part as well.

Stock height and parts for the most part, I'd run equal 1.2-1.5 neg camber up front and either 0 toe or a smidge out.

lowered, I'd go something between 1.5-1.7'ish neg camber, and the same 0'ish toe up front on a daily.

One thing to keep in mind in all of this, is that camber doesn't kill tires, toe does. so if you do a lot of acceleration, it lifts the front up, and causes the front tires to toe out slightly from their initial setting. So when I was running a more drag-focused(or mostly straight line) alignment, I'd run a bit of toe in, so when the front lifted, it would be at or near 0 toe for MAXIMUM TRACKTION!!!!!lol

hope that helps

 

[M-Sport fan]

I guess feel depends on driver for a lot of people, and suspension setups play a big part as well.

Stock height and parts for the most part, I'd run equal 1.2-1.5 neg camber up front and either 0 toe or a smidge out.

lowered, I'd go something between 1.5-1.7'ish neg camber, and the same 0'ish toe up front on a daily.

One thing to keep in mind in all of this, is that camber doesn't kill tires, toe does. so if you do a lot of acceleration, it lifts the front up, and causes the front tires to toe out slightly from their initial setting. So when I was running a more drag-focused(or mostly straight line) alignment, I'd run a bit of toe in, so when the front lifted, it would be at or near 0 toe for MAXIMUM TRACKTION!!!!!lol

hope that helps

YES, THANK YOU!!

I am on factory suspension and ride height, but with ET42 17x8s (Pro Race 1.2s) and 215/40-17 RS-RRs.

Still max out (even on both sides) caster?

 

[berlow94]

I would take advantage of as much caster as possible. (Dynamic camber change).

I think toe and camber can have equal effects on tire wear.
Running 1/32" toe out on my race car. I had a significant difference in wear running 3.5 degrees of camber vs. 3 degrees. (This is a dedicated track car with Toyo slick tires)

I like toe-in on the street to stop the car from catching the lines in the road. I also like toe out on the track/auto-x for the snappy turn-in.
My experience is only with rwd cars tho. Not sure how toe adjustments change with fwd cars.

For stock wheels/tires and stock suspension I feel that the factory camber is adequate.


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[tiggerbren]

Mine told me this same thing when I asked them to do settings which were still well WITHIN the 'factory spec' setting range (albeit to the far ends of it for some of the settings).

They refused to do this, EVEN with me offering to sign a waiver statement!

So, I have an appointment tomorrow at my local tuner shop to get this done, hence WHY I am asking.

I don't understand this. Factory specs are

Front
-1.18 +/-1.25 camber
4.08 +/-1.00 caster
0.20 degrees +/-0.20 degrees toe split (positive toe in, measured at curb ride height, full tank of fuel)

Rear
-0.64 +/-1.25 camber
0.00 degrees +/-0.50 degrees toe split

You could have -2.4 degree camber on the front and be within spec, but as has been pointed out, Ford gave us no way to adjust other than loosening a few bolts and squeezing out the slop.

If you have a Firestone nearby you should consider their lifetime alignment. I think it's under $200 bucks and they had no problem doing -2 degree front using the crash bolts I installed, and setting even toe. Both of those settings are within factory spec but I bet they'd set whatever I wanted. They seemed excited to cater to the autox folks.

 

[M-Sport fan]

I don't understand this.

NEITHER DO I!!

I even told them to look up the spec ranges in their shop manuals, but they were having NONE of it.

I guess that they just want to make the settings equal on both sides with whatever the f**k the settings are as the car rolled into them, and call it a day?!?
(Or just REFUSE to be 'told' what to set anything at??! )

 

[awwwww_shift]

YES, THANK YOU!!

I am on factory suspension and ride height, but with ET42 17x8s (Pro Race 1.2s) and 215/40-17 RS-RRs.

Still max out (even on both sides) caster?

Keep in mind that caster isn't "easily" adjustable on these cars, so you're pretty much stuck with whatever you are at already. (I mean, you could shift the subframe, but not many shops are gonna take on that kinda pita.)

 

[M-Sport fan]

Keep in mind that caster isn't "easily" adjustable on these cars, so you're pretty much stuck with whatever you are at already. (I mean, you could shift the subframe, but not many shops are gonna take on that kinda pita.)

So it's almost impossible to simply make both sides EVEN with each other for caster?

 

[XuperXero]

You can adjust with caster/camber plates, but gotta drill the strut tower.

 

[tiggerbren]

Also very easy to do with camber bolts in front.

 

[awwwww_shift]

Also very easy to do with camber bolts in front.

Some of us can't run those, for class legality.

Also, Caster should be pretty equallized from the factory, and any difference should be within a few tenths of a degree. I wouldn't sweat a few tenths on a street car.

Maybe in the future, some offset control arm bushings will come available(and hopefully in delrin for us crazy types) to help with adjustment of caster in the front of these cars.

 

[M-Sport fan]

Maybe in the future, some offset control arm bushings will come available(and hopefully in delrin for us crazy types) to help with adjustment of caster in the front of these cars.

+1!

But, those would also NOT be H/Street legal either, correct?

BTW; The shop was able to equalize the caster on both sides to 3.8, I know that's low, but at least it is dead even now, at least according to their printout (can they manipulate those printout figures at all if they get too lazy to try and get a target number?)
They only had to move the right side .2 (from 3.6) to get it there, (the left was already at 3.8 from the factory) so I am guessing that they REALLY did this??

 

[ansibe]

Very interesting thread, but to the OP's question:
Only toe is adjustable from the factory on the FiST. Zero toe works well on the street, and I'm happy on the track at that setting. Time-attack guys may want some toe-out, but I think it's a pia on the street.
My original caster is 4.1/4.2, and I expect most cars will be similar. My opinion is this caster is fine for street or track day use. Plus it's very hard to adjust!
I would aim for -1 front camber. You will likely need camber bolts to get there, but they are only $40 a set and easy to install. My camber bolts only got me -1.2. Damn.

 

[M-Sport fan]

^^^Somehow, the shop got me -1.1*, even on both sides on a 100% factory stock suspension (again, as long as I can trust their printout, and it cannot be manipulated by them to show whatever they want).

 

[ansibe]

I think I got a bit unlucky with mine, and yours is a good one. I just have to find a way to add a bit of neg camber.

 

[bodytech]

For a long time i've been running

Front
-2 degrees camber
0 toe

Rear
Whatever it is I guess as its barely adjustable if any.

Had pretty good success with this setup for turn in and high speed corners, minimal wear.

 

[HAHAFiST]

I'm on swift spec-r and stock wheel/tires. Any recommendation for my alignment if i plan to auto-x and do canyon runs? I do daily the car but have no issue with a little added wear.