Tuning your Audio System in your Fiesta

[antarctica24]

Antarctica,

I feel a kid reading Shakespeare! Great write up.

I wonder, just as a thought experiment, if you would consider suggesting some audio upgrade options for those of us on a budget or those agnostics who are unsure about being touched by the sound of God.

Maybe a stage 1-2-3 of audio upgrades?

Just a thought. I personally find the factory low-end completely embarrassing, to the point that I usually prefer not listening to music while driving. (All about that bass, bout that bass, bout that bass!). But I'm also not interested in spending a bunch of $$ for perfect audio, while simultaneously spending a bunch of $$ on go-fast mods.

Maybe you can recommend a small amp/sub combo that would get me to stage 1/2?

I used to have a bangin system in my old MR2, but I'm a noob at install, so all info is greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,
-cdo

Absolutely actually today I have lots to confirm after listening to another at that got a significant upgrade I will post my findings tonight

 

[antarctica24]

Antarctica,

I feel a kid reading Shakespeare! Great write up.

I wonder, just as a thought experiment, if you would consider suggesting some audio upgrade options for those of us on a budget or those agnostics who are unsure about being touched by the sound of God.

Maybe a stage 1-2-3 of audio upgrades?

Just a thought. I personally find the factory low-end completely embarrassing, to the point that I usually prefer not listening to music while driving. (All about that bass, bout that bass, bout that bass!). But I'm also not interested in spending a bunch of $$ for perfect audio, while simultaneously spending a bunch of $$ on go-fast mods.

Maybe you can recommend a small amp/sub combo that would get me to stage 1/2?

I used to have a bangin system in my old MR2, but I'm a noob at install, so all info is greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,
-cdo

Im posting your request tonight.

 

[They call me BK]

The factory system does not use 4 ohm speakers.

Am swapping out the factory speakers this weekend with Polk DB 6501s (had them sitting on the shelf for ages), putting the tweeters in the A Pillars. Anyways the factory speakers say 4 ohms 25 watts on the back. Not saying thats correct just what they say.

Precision Power vs MiniDSP? I'm thinking of the MiniDSP 2x4 with the front two channels for the components and channel three for the sub. Later get a second 2x4 and run all four channels for the components off of one 2x4 and the sub with L-R rear fill off of the other 2x4.

I'm not after Finger of God sound (at least not in this car at this time, my project car will give me much more room and creativity to play with), I just want clear sound that doesn't sound like its being played off of a boom box in my lap. That and I drive with my arm rested on the door, so I spent the last six months with my arm covering up the left tweeter!

 

[antarctica24]

Am swapping out the factory speakers this weekend with Polk DB 6501s (had them sitting on the shelf for ages), putting the tweeters in the A Pillars. Anyways the factory speakers say 4 ohms 25 watts on the back. Not saying thats correct just what they say.

Precision Power vs MiniDSP? I'm thinking of the MiniDSP 2x4 with the front two channels for the components and channel three for the sub. Later get a second 2x4 and run all four channels for the components off of one 2x4 and the sub with L-R rear fill off of the other 2x4.

I'm not after Finger of God sound (at least not in this car at this time, my project car will give me much more room and creativity to play with), I just want clear sound that doesn't sound like its being played off of a boom box in my lap. That and I drive with my arm rested on the door, so I spent the last six months with my arm covering up the left tweeter!

A couple of questions for clarification, are you using an amp? The 4ohm 25 watts is telling you maximum safe power on the speaker is 25 watts. Because you are not using an aftermarket radio that is clean the 25 watts should be taken at face value. What are you hopping to accomplish with the minidsp? Did you order yours with the 12 volt option?

 

[They call me BK]

A couple of questions for clarification, are you using an amp? The 4ohm 25 watts is telling you maximum safe power on the speaker is 25 watts. Because you are not using an aftermarket radio that is clean the 25 watts should be taken at face value. What are you hopping to accomplish with the minidsp? Did you order yours with the 12 volt option?

I haven't ordered anything yet, need to get through all the medical bills that hit on the same month. I am not using an amp yet, though I do have a brand new Profile AP1040 (http://www.crutchfield.com/S-6V97ABp3PgA/p_489AP1040/Profile-AP1040.html) that I have sitting around from the last car that never got installed. I had two sets of Polk Components, DB and MM, I installed the DB because of the lower RMS range, might swap out later.

I am trying to do this car in chunks as I daily drive it. So two weekends ago I sound deadened the trunk with KnoKnoise Kolossus, CCF, and MLV, extending forwards to under the first few inches of the carpet. Last weekend I removed the liners from the wheel wells on the outside, applied CLD tiles and as much CCF and MLV as I could without going to extremes (did you know the front wheel well has basically an open cavity facing the entire front edge of the door? Its "sealed" by the factory with very flimsy sound deadening, well I applied a 7" wide strip of MLV over that). Then I sprayed 3M 08881 over all of that and as much as I could once I masked everything off. Result is that while there is still excessive tire noise (we have very rough roads around here, on the interstate its barely noticeable now), the harshness is gone. Still more to be had, but happy with the $$ to result ratio.

So this weekend I'm replacing the speakers and moving the tweeters to the A Pillars. Next weekend I am going to try to install my old Rockford Fosgate sub and amp, and then see where I'm at. I want a quiet ride (not limo quiet, just as quiet as other cars I've had) with great clarity from the speakers. My old Paseo had Polk Momo in every location with another Profile AP1040 (that was stolen! grr) and it sounded amazing. Not perfect, but for only having a cheap Pioneer head unit it sounded right to me. This time, while I would like to have great sound, I'm content with being very budget conscious (hence re-using a lot of stuff from storage).

As to the MiniDSP, I'm intrigued mainly by the good reviews and price point. I want to level out the EQ curve bring the sub forwards so it's a part of the rest of the front sound stage. If I get a second MiniDSP I want to run each component on its own channel and provide some proper rear fill. (I know what a lot of people say about rear fill, but I like the feeling of being surrounded by music not just having it in front of me. If I can get just the fronts to do that, then great). Basically I either want to get to just shy of a DSP and have good/great sound or bite the bullet and dive in all the way.

Sorry if its long winded I just had my coffee

 

[antarctica24]

I haven't ordered anything yet, need to get through all the medical bills that hit on the same month. I am not using an amp yet, though I do have a brand new Profile AP1040 (http://www.crutchfield.com/S-6V97ABp3PgA/p_489AP1040/Profile-AP1040.html) that I have sitting around from the last car that never got installed. I had two sets of Polk Components, DB and MM, I installed the DB because of the lower RMS range, might swap out later.

I am trying to do this car in chunks as I daily drive it. So two weekends ago I sound deadened the trunk with KnoKnoise Kolossus, CCF, and MLV, extending forwards to under the first few inches of the carpet. Last weekend I removed the liners from the wheel wells on the outside, applied CLD tiles and as much CCF and MLV as I could without going to extremes (did you know the front wheel well has basically an open cavity facing the entire front edge of the door? Its "sealed" by the factory with very flimsy sound deadening, well I applied a 7" wide strip of MLV over that). Then I sprayed 3M 08881 over all of that and as much as I could once I masked everything off. Result is that while there is still excessive tire noise (we have very rough roads around here, on the interstate its barely noticeable now), the harshness is gone. Still more to be had, but happy with the $$ to result ratio.

So this weekend I'm replacing the speakers and moving the tweeters to the A Pillars. Next weekend I am going to try to install my old Rockford Fosgate sub and amp, and then see where I'm at. I want a quiet ride (not limo quiet, just as quiet as other cars I've had) with great clarity from the speakers. My old Paseo had Polk Momo in every location with another Profile AP1040 (that was stolen! grr) and it sounded amazing. Not perfect, but for only having a cheap Pioneer head unit it sounded right to me. This time, while I would like to have great sound, I'm content with being very budget conscious (hence re-using a lot of stuff from storage).

As to the MiniDSP, I'm intrigued mainly by the good reviews and price point. I want to level out the EQ curve bring the sub forwards so it's a part of the rest of the front sound stage. If I get a second MiniDSP I want to run each component on its own channel and provide some proper rear fill. (I know what a lot of people say about rear fill, but I like the feeling of being surrounded by music not just having it in front of me. If I can get just the fronts to do that, then great). Basically I either want to get to just shy of a DSP and have good/great sound or bite the bullet and dive in all the way.

Sorry if its long winded I just had my coffee

It sounds like your off to a good start. I would offer up that your going to pay 117.00 for the minidsp for only the front then have to turn around and buy another one for the rear and th dsp88r on eBay all day for less than 250.00. The dsp88r is 10 times the better piece over the minidsp.

 

[OggiSiMangia]

Too long; didn't read. Where's the cliff notes?

 

[claydough]

Im posting your request tonight.

Looking forward to this update when you have the time.

 

[antarctica24]

Looking forward to this update when you have the time.

It's posted called stage 1234&5

 

[GAbOS]

Too long; didn't read. Where's the cliff notes?

Sounds like your problem and not ours to make it short for you.

 

[GAbOS]

I agree that although the MiniDSP works it needs to stay a true 2.1 setup. The PI DSP gives way more headroom for the price.

 

[claydough]

It's posted called stage 1234&5

Got it thanks!

Thread for others interested:
http://www.fiestastforum.com/forum/threads/9039-Stage-1-2-3-4-5-audio-upgrade-suggestions

 

[mrdabbs]

I live part time in Bridgeport, CA and make it to Carson City pretty often and have a JL 10" Micro sub if you want to hear it. It may also be forsale as I'm going a different direction.

 

[mrdabbs]

[MENTION=3321]GAbOS[/MENTION] I Live part time in Bridgeport , CA so I'm in Carson City all the time. I do have a 10" JL micro sub if you want to hear it sometime, it may also be for sale as I'm going a different direction.

 

[Jims_ST]

Just wondering on the Fiesta ST if it is the separate box after the factory stereo which is doing the "factory tuning", if there was a way you could bypass just that box and get a clean signal out of the factory stereo to plug your amps into i.e avoiding the need for the JL Fix 82

 

[antarctica24]

Just wondering on the Fiesta ST if it is the separate box after the factory stereo which is doing the "factory tuning", if there was a way you could bypass just that box and get a clean signal out of the factory stereo to plug your amps into i.e avoiding the need for the JL Fix 82

That's my thought. If you think about it from an engineering point. Imagine your Sony and a manufacture ask you to supply a radio for their vehicles. And let's say it's more than I type of vehicle. And even more than one manufacturer. You have to make it cost effective for you. So you design the electronics as efficiently as possible so that each vehicle has the exact same electronics and then you design a box that has the tuning in it. That's the only way to go. Then the question becomes how to get the signal from the radio to the box and the out to the speakers. We know the speakers come out of the box under the display. I replaced that box with an aftermarket radio but I'm using the factory speakers at the moment and the tune didn't change. It just got louder because the amp in the aftermarket radio is better. Is it an electrical signal or digital signal. And is there something in the software telling it to look for that box meaning if the box is not there does the radio still play. So first you have to find the box. I suspect it is one of two boxes behind the glovebox. We need the helms manual to figure out which box it is and start by disconnecting it. Bypassing it would be the way to go, but it doesn't solve the signal voltage problem getting you to 4 volts out. But that could be overcome by using an acdio control line driver.

 

[Stormy]

Late to the party here but thanks for this thread and for your contributions on my build thread. I thought I had history and knowledge in this field but you're a real guru. I look forward to picking your big brain more in the future.

I am also curious about the alleged "line out" option on the Sony units. I can use a 4 channel LLC just fine but a 4v direct route would really be awesome.

 

[Stormy]

So, best components for our car, are the Pioneer TS-D1730C. They can be had for under $200.00 on Ebay, and a tiny bit of modification will be required for the door because the speaker is actually a 6.75" but if you have to do a two way, this is it.

If you want a direct replacement, Kenwood KFC-P709PS, Orion CO652C, Both are under $100 for the pair. Infinity Reference 5030cs. They are under $120 all available from crutchfield.

Thanks for these suggestions. I recently went to my neighborhood Car Toys and listened to pretty much every set of components they had up to $600 (despite my budget being far below that). My ears enjoyed the Alpine Sps-610c the best. Everything else including the Kenwood and Infinity sets I listened to (I don't recall which models, though) had very thin and boxy sounding mids. The Alpines had notably better depth and warm character to them, and the tweeters were bright without being sharp or sibilant. I'm wondering if you've heard them and can offer comparative input to your recommendations above.

Do you have recommendations for an affordable line driver. I am currently using basic Metra LLCs and have no idea what output voltage is. It seems adequate for my sub amp but if I'm going to upgrade and add DSP I don't want to skimp on input signal.

Lastly, I used to compete with Soundstream Class A amps, and before that I ran their Reference class AB amps. I have a good history with Soundstream and am now looking at the Picasso Nano PN5.640d to run my future system. I know it'll fit where my TC2002 currently sits and the price is right. Any opinions on that unit?

Thanks!

 

[antarctica24]

Thanks for these suggestions. I recently went to my neighborhood Car Toys and listened to pretty much every set of components they had up to $600 (despite my budget being far below that). My ears enjoyed the Alpine Sps-610c the best. Everything else including the Kenwood and Infinity sets I listened to (I don't recall which models, though) had very thin and boxy sounding mids. The Alpines had notably better depth and warm character to them, and the tweeters were bright without being sharp or sibilant. I'm wondering if you've heard them and can offer comparative input to your recommendations above.

Do you have recommendations for an affordable line driver. I am currently using basic Metra LLCs and have no idea what output voltage is. It seems adequate for my sub amp but if I'm going to upgrade and add DSP I don't want to skimp on input signal.

Lastly, I used to compete with Soundstream Class A amps, and before that I ran their Reference class AB amps. I have a good history with Soundstream and am now looking at the Picasso Nano PN5.640d to run my future system. I know it'll fit where my TC2002 currently sits and the price is right. Any opinions on that unit?

Thanks!

First I think it's great that your upgrading your system. I. Teaming up with Chicago slick and jmrtsus to help people get the best advice on upgrading their sound system. I take the audio experience very seriously. I think it's a personal experience and it's different for everyone. With that said I would encourage you to ask those two the same question so you get a well rounded answer to your question. Let them know I sent you their way 😁

I do want to say this. Picking speakers from a car stereo is tough because the environment is not the same as it will be in the car. The displays are just junk at best for enclosures. With that said if you head a set of speakers and they sounded good in the display you can bet they will great in the car. I have not heard that specific set but alone makes great stuff and great sounding speakers. I forget sometimes.

As for line driver the audio control lc2i is a favorite of mine.

As for the sound stream amps. Back in the day when they were made here when I was judging I could tell when I was hearing a soundstream amp over any other amp. They had a really unique sound very different from every thing else. As for their new stuff, I don't know. I know it's not the same company and their stuff is made overseas like everybody else. Is that bad? Probably not. It's really all we have to work with right? The soundstream stuff looks really good on paper. I would one off eBay to save some money and try it out. If it doesn't work sound wise your not out a lot of money. I don't remember if they participate in cea or not. Cea makes sure that what they say their amps are putting out they really are putting out.

I hope that helps and reach out to the other two guys to get their opinion so that you get options to choose from.

 

[antarctica24]

Late to the party here but thanks for this thread and for your contributions on my build thread. I thought I had history and knowledge in this field but you're a real guru. I look forward to picking your big brain more in the future.

I am also curious about the alleged "line out" option on the Sony units. I can use a 4 channel LLC just fine but a 4v direct route would really be awesome.

I read that the Ford software everyone is using gave that option. I don't think it would be too much of a problem to ask the dealer about being able to switch it and see what he says.

You would have to take the speaker leads and make RCA's out of them. But that certainly would make things easier in the upgrade.

I'll say this, as I have said many other times about signal voltage. There would not be more than 2 volts max coming from the factory head. Your amps need 4 volts of signal to get the rated power from your aftermarket amp.

Those that have added aftermarket amps for subs are missing out on a lot of impact with their subs. The difference in sub impact and sound is 2 fold when going from 2 volts to 4 volts. It makes a huge difference. If your coming off of the factory speakers, the lc2i from audio control will get you the 4 volts and then some but you have to careful as you'll burn up the input stage on the amp if you go far.