Traction control and wet track HPDE

[meFiSTo]

Headed to Portland International for my first HPDE event in the FiST on Saturday. It could be wet. I'm wondering whether it might be handy to leave the traction control software fully enabled with the wet conditions. Especially if it is raining with any kind of intensity. I know I won't be driving as hard, so the brakes are not likely to overheat from the combination of hard driving and the tractional control logic tapping the brakes under turning. Any thoughts about that here? Thanks.

My only ever off resulting in touching something (slow speed slide into a concrete barrier) was in the wet at Portland, so I want to do everything possible to stay on the pavement. Building speed slowly and finding the dry line are my first steps, but if I can get the car to help without burning up my pads, so much the better.

 

[RAAMaudio]

No experience in the wet yet but I would leave on all nannies until you feel more comfortable and then possibly do a bit of testing with them off. I would imagine the wet weather will keep the brakes cool enough to use the nannies full time and possibly allow faster laps.

Again, no experience with this yet so my thoughts are speculative at best.

 

[rodmoe]

Leaving the nannies full on may prove troublesome if the ESC cuts engine power when the car spins the tires in the wet leaving someone behind you unaware of the power loss. Sport mode would allow the tires a bit more freedom before cutting power allowing you to adjust your right foot to stay online and in control. Torque vectoring will always be here to help keep you inline.
But as others have said play with it till you are comfortable. If you are worried start with a slower or novice group you can most times ask to be moved up to a quicker group.

 

[RAAMaudio]

Much better response than mine, I will take note of this and use accordingly my first time in the wet

 

[Sourskittle]

I did the dragon about 5 times wet ( not raining, but def wet ). I left on all the nannies ( more than a concrete wall awaits the foolish on that road ). But... It over heated the crap out of the rear brakes. They were smelling pretty bad. The electro lsd with over heated the front, the stability control will eat up the rears. You can prob stop the stability control by un-plugging the yaw sensor in the rear, but do so at your own risk. It works on G35/350z, but no idea what kind of angry it would make the fist as far as CEL or others.

 

[crankin]

I did the dragon about 5 times wet ( not raining, but def wet ). I left on all the nannies ( more than a concrete wall awaits the foolish on that road ). But... It over heated the crap out of the rear brakes. They were smelling pretty bad. The electro lsd with over heated the front, the stability control will eat up the rears. You can prob stop the stability control by un-plugging the yaw sensor in the rear, but do so at your own risk. It works on G35/350z, but no idea what kind of angry it would make the fist as far as CEL or others.

Interesting where might one find this sensor?

 

[Sourskittle]

Take out the thingy/board that covered the spare tire. Look between the back seats before the spare tire well. I believe that is your yaw

 

[crankin]

Take out the thingy/board that covered the spare tire. Look between the back seats before the spare tire well. I believe that is your yaw

I'll have a look.

 

[Siestarider]

Headed to Portland International for my first HPDE event in the FiST on Saturday. It could be wet. I'm wondering whether it might be handy to leave the traction control software fully enabled with the wet conditions. Especially if it is raining with any kind of intensity. I know I won't be driving as hard, so the brakes are not likely to overheat from the combination of hard driving and the tractional control logic tapping the brakes under turning. Any thoughts about that here? Thanks.

My only ever off resulting in touching something (slow speed slide into a concrete barrier) was in the wet at Portland, so I want to do everything possible to stay on the pavement. Building speed slowly and finding the dry line are my first steps, but if I can get the car to help without burning up my pads, so much the better.

My first HDPE was in rain. I left nannies full on. Nannies are so good, I probably scared my instructor and definitely developed higher confidence in my track skill than deserved. Definitely was surprised at how quickly I could go in the wet.

Second HDPE (same track) was dry, I went Sport a couple laps, then turned it off. 4 turns later I spun 630 degrees, totally my mistake. Fortunately no harm done.

My take is that I did not appreciate how subtle and effective the nannies are. I learned a lot more about tracking mine in with three laps with nannies off than with 30 laps them on.

I will not drive on the street without them, nor on track with them. May even go to LSD because tracking shows me just how much even that one residual nanny does.

Car is still better than I, but I am catching up.

 

[meFiSTo]

Turns out the day was incredible weather wise. Topped out in the low to mid 60s -- pretty much partial sun, overcast, partial sun all day. Dry as a bone. It was handy that the few days prior were somewhat wet as the track was pretty clean (despite goose grease in a couple of spots).

Generally ran with all the traction control software (the stuff that can be disabled with our one button) turned off, except in the first session, during which I forgot to turn it off. Probably could have tried to disable it on the main straight during that session although I was strapped down quite tight AutoX style -- so maybe not on second thought.

I did have an interesting observation though during that first session. We were red flagged and when I came to a stop at the next corner station, I noticed smoke coming from the front passenger side wheel well and billowing out of the engine bay. it was a little disconcerting. We were sent back to grid and took two more laps, one of which was actual cool down. Came back to the paddock and all seemed fine. But I do think leaving the nannies full on contributed to that overheating. Didn't help that we came to an immediate stop with no cool down during the red flag situation.

Here's a post event pic of that pad and rotor:

Seems fine. In fact, it's hard to believe I did 6 full sessions on those pads -- although I'll cop to focusing more on getting a feeling for the car (first track day in it) than wanting to test the car's performance edge. But I didn't exactly drive slowly (all the Miatas, vintage racer Alfas, and even a couple of BRZs and older Porsches in my session will attest to that). I just wasn't going all out.

I posted the same image with that notes I added to my build thread, where I'll kind of keep a running log of this kind of stuff until it gets too unwieldy.

In any event, I didn't really get a chance assess the controllable nannies in the wet yesterday. Maybe some time in the future, although I try to avoid wet events when possible. They're like driving around town in the rain for me (but a little faster). I'm not so keen on "testing the limits" in the wet at a track with concrete walls, so I hunt for the dry line, stay off that paint, brake straight, and work to stay steady as possible (very boring). I prefer a little trail braking and intentional dry track sliding for my fun.

 

[Siestarider]

I too am amazed at the pad wear, changed rear pads with 30% left after 10K on street and 4 hrs track time. Fronts still 50%.

PBIR is pretty safe re concrete walls, so in the wet I was deliberately trying to drift turns and did, but those nannies are careful indeed. Mostly having too much fun.

I would run without them in wet next time, carefully probe the envelope, which for me is as good as fun gets.

I am learning the hardest part of being quick is being completely disciplined, when my spirit and car both say Hooligan!, its tough.

 

[Siestarider]

PBIR last weekend, sky opened up and I drove first time in seriously wet conditions. This car loves the rain. Just about everyone quit, I eventually took the checkered alone (even flag stations wanted out of rain).

With nannies off, traction control will intervene if you push it. Still on BFG Sport Comps, pretty good in rain. Apexes under 6" of water was interesting, definitely required new lines.


Turned nannies on and easily quicker than anyone out there when conditions were really wet. Course, most of the cars out were a lot more costly and probably cautious too.

In a later session with wet track and ordinary rain vs frog strangler, a Fist like mine came out for a couple laps with me and was a little faster with nannies on than I was without.

All in all, great fun.

 

[RAAMaudio]

Great report, glad the systems work so well in the rain too!

I lean towards the Hooligan side of things a bit too far most of the time but sure fun

 

[floydthebarberbeefcake]

I find this thread useful, may try disconnecting the yaw when I purchase the Fiesta ST and see what it does.