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TB Performance Torsion Bar
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I have the Pierce strut tower brace and lower front 2-point stress bar as well as the TB Performance trunk brace and rear lower torsion bar. All of these bars together have improved the handling of my car immensely. I do need to state that I'm lowered on Mountune springs and have 15mm spacers up front and 20mm spacers in the rear. Still on stock wheels/tires as well.
I had the Pierce bars before the springs and spacers. There was a noticeable difference wit just those two bars. I noticed a bit more understeer on my car. It just felt like it wanted to go where I wanted it to go.
Now, add in the TB Performance bars and like others have mentioned, the car feels like it's on rails. It turns so well. I railed a left hand turn trying to make a green light (which I did) and the car never felt like it wanted to push wider than I was steering.
I highly recommend the TB Performance bars that I have purchased. From the experience of others, I hear all his bars/braces are just as awesome.
I had the Pierce bars before the springs and spacers. There was a noticeable difference wit just those two bars. I noticed a bit more understeer on my car. It just felt like it wanted to go where I wanted it to go.
Now, add in the TB Performance bars and like others have mentioned, the car feels like it's on rails. It turns so well. I railed a left hand turn trying to make a green light (which I did) and the car never felt like it wanted to push wider than I was steering.
I highly recommend the TB Performance bars that I have purchased. From the experience of others, I hear all his bars/braces are just as awesome.
I have had the TB-Performance stage 3 set on my FiST sense it was new.
In fact I was the first to test them on the FiST.
I had the set on my '11 Fiesta SES and loved them so I had to put them on the FiST.
I have made some custom mods to the TB lateral braces to make them stronger.
I also have the Pierce lower 4 point brace.
I choose the Pierce 4 point brace because I have the TB front brace.
However I will soon be removing the Pierce 4 point and replacing it with the 6 point brace.
This means I will also be removing the TB front lower brace.
Dave
In fact I was the first to test them on the FiST.
I had the set on my '11 Fiesta SES and loved them so I had to put them on the FiST.
I have made some custom mods to the TB lateral braces to make them stronger.
I also have the Pierce lower 4 point brace.
I choose the Pierce 4 point brace because I have the TB front brace.
However I will soon be removing the Pierce 4 point and replacing it with the 6 point brace.
This means I will also be removing the TB front lower brace.
Dave
TB-Performance does not make anything the same as the Pierce lower brace.
If you have or plan to have the TB front lower brace then you will need to use the Pierce 2 point brace.
Only a custom built Pierce 4 point brace will work with the TB front brace (as mine is) and the Pierce 6 point will not work at all.
If you have not purchased either as of yet.
Then I would suggest the Pierce 6 point lower brace as it will do the job of both the Pierce 4 point and the TB front brace together in one unit.
Please do not misunderstand.
Both are great companies and provide great products.
It just depends on what you wish to do.
Dave
If you have or plan to have the TB front lower brace then you will need to use the Pierce 2 point brace.
Only a custom built Pierce 4 point brace will work with the TB front brace (as mine is) and the Pierce 6 point will not work at all.
If you have not purchased either as of yet.
Then I would suggest the Pierce 6 point lower brace as it will do the job of both the Pierce 4 point and the TB front brace together in one unit.
Please do not misunderstand.
Both are great companies and provide great products.
It just depends on what you wish to do.
Dave
I notice with hard turn in and accelerating out, the inside front wheel has hardly any traction. When compared to my older FoST, that would power out much more effectively. I certainly notice the chassis flex in this instance. How much of an impact does this have on front wheel traction powering out of a corner?
Thread Starter
#53
While I haven't tested for this exact situation I believe a flatter rear end would also mean the front is a bit flatter as well.
I have a Pierce 2 point front bar arriving tomorrow to ensure my front end suspension geometry stays as intended under the increased cornering loads.
I have a Pierce 2 point front bar arriving tomorrow to ensure my front end suspension geometry stays as intended under the increased cornering loads.
Sounds about right.
What do you think about the TB Torsion Bar's ability to reduce 3-wheelin compared to a RSB?
Moreover, what is the difference between getting the Pierce 2 point bar and a front sway bar? It seems that the Pierce bar is an addition and might affect ground clearance whereas the FSB is a replacement for the factory FSB. Would you consider replacing your FSB in addition to installing the Pierce 2 point?
By the way, thanks so much for addressing my questions. I geek out over suspensions and chassis and I can't wait to learn from yours and many others experience to get my car dialed in for my tastes.
What do you think about the TB Torsion Bar's ability to reduce 3-wheelin compared to a RSB?
Moreover, what is the difference between getting the Pierce 2 point bar and a front sway bar? It seems that the Pierce bar is an addition and might affect ground clearance whereas the FSB is a replacement for the factory FSB. Would you consider replacing your FSB in addition to installing the Pierce 2 point?
By the way, thanks so much for addressing my questions. I geek out over suspensions and chassis and I can't wait to learn from yours and many others experience to get my car dialed in for my tastes.
Thread Starter
#57
Technically, it should increase the height the inside rear tire is lifted due to the fact that it more solidly ties both sides together. Anecdotally, however, it feels like the car is flatter which really doesn't make sense.
I think if you make the car's cornering speed the static variable and then observe height of inside rear wheel lift while passing through the same turn at the same speed, with the bar it will be lower because there's less lateral weight transfer and more grip.
The Pierce 2 point and a front sway bar are drastically different. The Pierce bar just ties the front of the lower a-arms together at their rotation point. It doesn't affect roll-stiffness at all. Instead, it helps to ensure that the suspension geometry stays as intended even under heavy cornering loads.
As for ground clearance, the Pierce front bar will still be closer to the car than the rubber air dam that's under the bumper. I expect to lose *maybe* 1" of ground clearance after installing this bar. I'll measure.
I am not considering an upgraded front sway bar at all. Tightening up the front of the car would dial OUT any oversteer we're getting now and increase the tendency to understeer. Additionally, getting on the power hard after a tight turn where the outside tire is loaded up would definitely induce wheelspin on the inside front and an FSB would make it worse. Now that I'm Stage 3 the traction struggle is real, LOL.
You're very welcome and I don't mind at all. Right now I have mad respect for the ST suspension engineers. I thought I knew exactly what would happen with the torsion bar addition. I thought the car would be super tail-happy. It's not. I think this is a testament to the amount of engineering and testing they put in. I think the car is just so well balanced that when we start messing with it, the changes won't be as predictable as we think.
Luckily, the torsion bar improves steering response and ultimate cornering grip so it's staying on.
I think if you make the car's cornering speed the static variable and then observe height of inside rear wheel lift while passing through the same turn at the same speed, with the bar it will be lower because there's less lateral weight transfer and more grip.
The Pierce 2 point and a front sway bar are drastically different. The Pierce bar just ties the front of the lower a-arms together at their rotation point. It doesn't affect roll-stiffness at all. Instead, it helps to ensure that the suspension geometry stays as intended even under heavy cornering loads.
As for ground clearance, the Pierce front bar will still be closer to the car than the rubber air dam that's under the bumper. I expect to lose *maybe* 1" of ground clearance after installing this bar. I'll measure.
I am not considering an upgraded front sway bar at all. Tightening up the front of the car would dial OUT any oversteer we're getting now and increase the tendency to understeer. Additionally, getting on the power hard after a tight turn where the outside tire is loaded up would definitely induce wheelspin on the inside front and an FSB would make it worse. Now that I'm Stage 3 the traction struggle is real, LOL.
You're very welcome and I don't mind at all. Right now I have mad respect for the ST suspension engineers. I thought I knew exactly what would happen with the torsion bar addition. I thought the car would be super tail-happy. It's not. I think this is a testament to the amount of engineering and testing they put in. I think the car is just so well balanced that when we start messing with it, the changes won't be as predictable as we think.
Luckily, the torsion bar improves steering response and ultimate cornering grip so it's staying on.
To add to Iso, from the moment I drove this car I knew I wouldn't be upgrading the FSB or adding a rear. When I saw the torsion bar, I was very curious. The front end didn't want to plow across the road, but it will three-wheel. My intuition told me a torsion bar would do much better than a sway bar. The rear end is already connected, so I think the key difference between a RSB and TB is WHERE its reinforced. I can't explain it because I'm not an engineer. But where you reinforce makes a difference. Based on my intuition, I'd say that most of the energy is being held at the center, whereas with a RSB the energy is loaded much more off center since the entire beam is reinforced.
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