Recommendation for Making my FiST Stage III

[frankiefiesta]

The 2j FMIC is the largest intercooler that can be used with the stock crashbar. It's also $400. If they ever start shipping, I'd recommend that, if you don't want to go DHM.

Finally spoke with Joe yesterday. Told me they should be done mid/end of February. Believe the price is still $400 but it will go up he said.

 

[krico38]

FYI, DHM will add a BOV flange and sell you a TiAL Q BOV to go with it for basically what you'd spend just buying the valve....

I wouldn't bother with a charge pipe on the stock turbo. I'll be selling my Turbosmart BOV in about a month (or whenever my DHM IC comes in) if you want to go that route.

I'll buy ur BOV when it's available

 

[GateCityRadio]

Yeah and the messed up part is I wasn't even disagreeing with people. They came at me when I wasn't even saying anything. Damn! This is some childish bullshit. But oh well I got some good advice and I'll keep everyone posted on what I decided to do.

I wasn't trying to fight either...I came in here and answered your original question with what I done to get to stage 3. It's just some BS when someone who has never seen your car or knows how it runs tries to tell you what you did won't work or is crap when I drive the thing every day and have no issues. Again sorry if I offended anyone with my suggestions. Good luck with whatever you do and I'm sorry Wimp Lo if I came across the wrong way. I'm curious to see the cost and outcome of this build now.

 

[Wimp Lo]

You are missing the whole concept of stages. You are also really lucky that the Fiesta ST ECU has powerful learning strategies to correct for changing fuel, weather and hardware.

Stages in the context of a Fiesta ST are a combination of specific parts and an off the shelf tune that has been optimized for that combo so that the ECU can use it's correction factors to deal with changing fuel and weather, not hardware. There is design, intent and tuning behind a stage.

A grab bag with an OTS tune has some level of intent but the pieces were not necessarily designed to work together and the tune is designed to work with something else. It should not even be called a stage.

A grab bag with a good custom tune can range from mediocre to excellent depending on how well the parts work together. This shouldn't be called a stage either but it is a lot closer.

If a tuner works up a selection of parts from various sources and a tune to work with that combo, that's a stage if the tuner wants to call it that.

In general a stage should have a name attached to it like Cobb Stage 3, Roush Stage 3, etc.

You can declare yourself a tuner and make a GateCityRadio Stage 3 but the worst kind of tuners are those that steal tunes...

 

[GateCityRadio]

You are missing the whole concept of stages. You are also really lucky that the Fiesta ST ECU has powerful learning strategies to correct for changing fuel, weather and hardware.

Stages in the context of a Fiesta ST are a combination of specific parts and an off the shelf tune that has been optimized for that combo so that the ECU can use it's correction factors to deal with changing fuel and weather, not hardware. There is design, intent and tuning behind a stage.

A grab bag with an OTS tune has some level of intent but the pieces were not necessarily designed to work together and the tune is designed to work with something else. It should not even be called a stage.

A grab bag with a good custom tune can range from mediocre to excellent depending on how well the parts work together. This shouldn't be called a stage either but it is a lot closer.

If a tuner works up a selection of parts from various sources and a tune to work with that combo, that's a stage if the tuner wants to call it that.

In general a stage should have a name attached to it like Cobb Stage 3, Roush Stage 3, etc.

You can declare yourself a tuner and make a GateCityRadio Stage 3 but the worst kind of tuners are those that steal tunes...

I'm not a tuner and I'm not stealing anything or turning a profit off someone else's work...I'm just a guy that pieced together a kit to run a canned Cobb Stage III tune, and it works. I was this sharing that because it answered the OPs original question. This isn't my end game anyway, just a stepping stone on my way to a custom tune (either tune+ or a dyno tune).
I respect your opinion, but lets just agree to disagree at this point.

 

[dyn085]

Ok guys. I want to make my FiST stage III in the next 2-3 months. It's bone stock right now. I would like some recommendations on which brands of upgrades I should get. The Cobb Stage III kit is nearly $3k. Can I save money be piecing together my own kit from multiple brands? I don't want to go cheap and sacrifice quality but if I can make a stage III kit from multiple sources that's just as good as Cobb but for less money I want to go that route. Thanks

I read the thread and seems how most of the response was garbage I just went back to your OP.

Yes, you can use parts other than the Cobb parts with the Stage 3 OTS tune. No, you don't need a filter, charge pipes, or a full exhaust. Depending on where you look you'll have conflicting data/opinions, but an improved FMIC and DP (or FMIC and CBE, depending on your sources) can yield pretty much maximum Stage 3 OTS power. 'Stages' on the FiST is basically a joke and only really a way for vendors to sell parts or for members to give a quick summary of their parts installation.

There's lots of data on the FMIC, DP, and CBE options for you to research and formulate an opinion. Outside of using two of those three parts (FMIC mandatory) you're not going to get much of any ROI at all. I wouldn't worry about having the absolute biggest FMIC or buying the most expensive of anything and concentrate on finding the best fuel along your normal usage.

I would strongly consider a custom tune though, even if you went with the most expensive or best (they're not the same) part for everything. A good custom tuner will extract what he can based on what you have and I've seen FiST owners that have achieved really good power with just an FMIC and quality fuel. Ymmv.

 

[krico38]

Ok then let me rephrase my question. What is the best way to get the most power out of my car without going big turbo?

 

[dyn085]

Ok then let me rephrase my question. What is the best way to get the most power out of my car without going big turbo and running on 91 or 93 octane?

That's what I just described, but you're wasting your time if you're not going to run premium fuel because 87 just can't handle the timing. Not that you can't run it, and I've tuned my car to be able to use it if necessary, but it isn't something you want to try and 'get the most power' out if your car with. Your car is your choice, though.

 

[krico38]

That's what I just described, but you're wasting your time if you're not going to run premium fuel because 87 just can't handle the timing. Not that you can't run it, and I've tuned my car to be able to use it if necessary, but it isn't something you want to try and 'get the most power' out if your car with. Your car is your choice, though.

Sorry I meant that I want to run 91 or 93.

 

[frankiefiesta]

Ok then let me rephrase my question. What is the best way to get the most power out of my car without going big turbo?

Do you guys have ethanol over in PA? In jersey it's extremely hard to come by. Best way to make most power but not break the bank (IMO) on stock turbo would be FMIC, e30 blend w/93, downpipe, custom tune.

If no ethanol then try and run 93.

 

[krico38]

Do you guys have ethanol over in PA? In jersey it's extremely hard to come by. Best way to make most power but not break the bank (IMO) on stock turbo would be FMIC, e30 blend w/93, downpipe, custom tune.

If no ethanol then try and run 93.

It's very hard to come by here as well. Thanks

 

[dyn085]

Sorry I meant that I want to run 91 or 93.

Good. There are far too many members that want 'all the power' and then state that they don't want to run anything greater than 87 octane. It's weird, really.

E-blends are a great way to make cheap power but you need custom tuning for it and have to constantly be ensuring that you run the minimum E-content that you were tuned for or swap back to other tunes when you can't. It's not a huge deal if it's easily accessible or if you make a custom map to cover different blends, but outside of that it's more work than I would care to do for much other than the occasional track day.

 

[GateCityRadio]

So from what I gather, as long as the DP is catted you are fine. This is just for if someone in the future searches and can find this info in regards to the original question, not to restart the argument.
I still agree with everyone else that the pro-tune is going to be better. I've just used the Cobb Stage 3 tune as a stepping stone to the pro-tune. I've been looking into tune+ and Adam seems to be the guy to go to for these tunes.

Again, good luck.

 

[Wimp Lo]

Ask him if the results will be the same.

 

[masonsturbos]

Considering this car is set to make a certain amount of torque- can't think of actual lingo- then yes, it may be set to say 250ft/lbs and when it gets there it is happy. Basically even if you ran big turbo- in theory- you'd hit 250ft/lbs then it would limit itself and you'd be tuned.
That's what is going through my mind

 

[Wimp Lo]

Did he say that?

 

[GateCityRadio]

Without putting a two cars on the same dyno in the same conditions (one with cobb hardware and the other with different hardware) we can't know for sure and I'm not spending money on that just to settle an argument on the interwebz . Running the same tune with similar parts I think we can assume the output will be similar, or at least very close.

 

[JasonHaven]

My 'stage 3' plan is [MENTION=2905]www.cp-e.com[/MENTION] FMIC and Intake*, [MENTION=3805]Tune+[/MENTION] tune and internal wastegate, and [MENTION=3178]maperformance[/MENTION] catback.

A lot of folks say the DHM race intercooler, and replacing the downpipe are unnecessary for the stock turbo.


* CP-E is a bit expensive, but they make good stuff. There's probably other companies that make effective stuff for cheaper, but I'm not an expert.

 

[Waterfan]

Ok then let me rephrase my question. What is the best way to get the most power out of my car without going big turbo?

Listen to Wimp Lo

 

[MyGoKart]

Listen to Wimp Lo

lol...