Don't Let Oil Temps Stop The Fiesta! Mishimoto Oil Cooler R&D!

[mishimoto1]

another restrictive area is the fan shroud. (as I can sure someone there noticed already) Instead of us guys that have swiss cheesed ours with drills and deremels, a redesigned one that allows better airflow at speed or even a larger fan would be beneficial to those unwilling to cut stuff up.

What is the point of the shroud design from Ford? If it's restrictive at speed, why design it that way?

Also it allows the stock cooling fan to pull the most air across the radiator surface in traffic or while stopped thus helping to cool it.

Correct, the factory fan shroud is in place to provide optimal airflow pull when the fan is in motion. The shape allows airflow to be spread to the full footprint of the core for improved cooling during idle/traffic conditions. The stock shroud incorporates a few air flaps which open when at speed to provide improved flow through the core, but close when stopped to aid in airflow pull with the fan. We've seen this particular system incorporated on a variety of OE shrouds in the past.

We've actually developed a few shrouds with at-speed airflow in mind for both the E36 and E46 BMW. An example is shown below.

A slight amount of airflow is given up at idle conditions, but the advantages of flow at speed are rather significant. We also test these systems to ensure the fan is adequately cooling the vehicle at idle.

We are working on some pretty innovative designs for the Fiesta in terms of a radiator/shroud system of sorts. I can't quite release details/images yet, but we may have something to show in the coming weeks.

I didn't see this asked before, and it may not be feasible since you are already working on a separate radiator and an oil cooler. I think a combination radiator and oil cooler where this is one unit, where the oil cooler is on the bottom of the radiator would work for the stock crash bar as well as for those of us that have the Deadhook Motorsports crash bar. You may want to consider this option. This would be fabricated like your radiators for cars with automatic transmissions. With the radiator mounting holes in the front to mount the Deadhook intercooler, this would work very well, as well as for all other aftermarket intercoolers and the stock IC. I would buy this option in a heartbeat.

Thanks Westcoats! We have had such requests regarding a radiator with incorporated internal tank for oil cooling. It was certainly considered, however we decided to pursue two different components for coolant regulation and oil temperature regulation. This allows customers to purchase just one component if they prefer to do so. Packaging the two products together would not provide options, which we try to do if possible.

That being said, if a market persists for this particular setup, we can certainly consider it as a future addition to our Fiesta lineup. Thanks for the recommendation!

Thanks
-John

 

[mishimoto1]

Our discounted pre-sale is now live! Check out the details below.

Pre-Sale Link!!

Mishimoto Ford Fiesta ST Oil Cooler Kit!

Pre-Sale Price:

Non-Thermostatic: $454.95

Thermostatic: $494.95

MSRP:

Non-Thermostatic: $585.00

Thermostatic: $635.00

Pre-Sale Expiration Date: 9/11/2015

Estimated Ship Date: 9/11/2015

Product Specs

• Direct-fit for the 2014+ Ford Fiesta ST
• Reduces oil temperatures by 35?F (19.5?C)
• Minimal pressure drop
• Application-specific mounting brackets
• Oil cooler location does not interfere with aftermarket air intakes
• Works with stock and most aftermarket intercooler kits
• Pre-made stainless steel braided oil lines with durable -AN fittings
• Billet aluminum oil sandwich plate
• Designed to easily bypass the stock liquid-to-liquid oil cooler
• 19-row stacked-plate oil cooler for optimal fluid temperature reduction
• Thermostatic and Non-thermostatic options available
• Cooler available in either Sleek Silver or Stealth Black
• Increases oil capacity by .65qt
• Mishimoto Lifetime Warranty

Images

Product R&D
http://engineering.mishimoto.com/?cat=316

Tech Specs

Pre-Sale Link!!

Feel free to follow-up with any questions regarding this kit!

Thanks
-John

 

[Rhinopolis]

I am running late for work and pounding coffee, so I am quickly glancing through this right now, and is there an install guide available? If the install is straightforward, I am interested in the presale.

Also, what is the difference (added benefit) between thermostatic and non?

 

[Young L]

Also, what is the difference (added benefit) between thermostatic and non?

click the R&D link and it explains it. Cliff note: thermostatic for daily/track use, non for just track.

 

[Chuckable]

The install guide wasn't up as of yesterday that I saw. Thermostatic is for street driven vehicles. Otherwise your oil will likely never get to optimum temp.

 

[meFiSTo]

I am running late for work and pounding coffee, so I am quickly glancing through this right now, and is there an install guide available? If the install is straightforward, I am interested in the presale.

In post #11 of the "all things Mishimoto" thread, Sara addresses the question about installation with this comment:

We will be doing an install video for both the radiator as well as the oil cooler for your reference once the product is released.

 

[gabe]

I would absolutely buy this. However like a few others I won't be buying it unless it fits the DHM intercooler and crash bar.

 

[lessard.dcj]

[MENTION=1848]mishimoto[/MENTION] will you guys be doing a pre order package with the Rad/oil Cooler as well?
just wondering.

 

[koozy]

Oil cooler order placed. Black, thermostatic. Thanks!

 

[mishimoto1]

I am running late for work and pounding coffee, so I am quickly glancing through this right now, and is there an install guide available? If the install is straightforward, I am interested in the presale.

Also, what is the difference (added benefit) between thermostatic and non?

click the R&D link and it explains it. Cliff note: thermostatic for daily/track use, non for just track.

The install guide wasn't up as of yesterday that I saw. Thermostatic is for street driven vehicles. Otherwise your oil will likely never get to optimum temp.

Thanks Young! Our installation guide is not yet complete, however it will be ready once these kits start shipping out. We will have both a written guide and video tutorial which will take you through the process step-by-step.

For any vehicle that will see street use, we highly recommend the thermostatic option. Being that the factory heat exchanger is removed, oil warmup is going to be rather slow with no thermostat in place. Our thermostatic sandwich plate restricts flow to the cooler until activation temperature (185?F) is reached. This will ensure the fluid is warmed up quickly to reduce wear attributed to cold oil. If you are in an extremely hot climate, the non-thermostatic option could possibly be used for a street-driven vehicle, assuming the vehicle is not driven hard until fluid is up to operating temperatures.

I would absolutely buy this. However like a few others I won't be buying it unless it fits the DHM intercooler and crash bar.

Sorry! The DHM crash bar eliminates the cooler mounting points we've designed our mounting bracket around. For those with the DHM setup, one of our universal oil cooler setups would be an option assuming you do not mind fabricating a cooler mounting bracket and modifying the oil lines slightly.

[MENTION=1848]mishimoto[/MENTION] will you guys be doing a pre order package with the Rad/oil Cooler as well?
just wondering.

Thanks for the interest! We will be running a separate discounted pre-sale on our radiator, however we still have some development and testing to complete on that particular project. We will not offer a combo pre-sale with both components. More information on the radiator should be posted up soon!

Oil cooler order placed. Black, thermostatic. Thanks!

Thanks for the order Koozy!

-John

 

[RAAMaudio]

Glad you have taken the time to develop this cooler system as well needed, I did my own setup so not needed but others sure can use it!

For track/street cars the stat is a must, also the stock water to oil cooler likely helps bring up oil temps faster than removing the unit but taking it out saves weight and allows more room for a larger oil filter which I highly recommend.

NOTE: It would be a great idea to drill big holes in the stock crash sensor bar as it is of a very restrictive design blocking much of the airflow to the coolers.

OR: Mishimoto, build a replacement with much better airflow, an easy and effective part that could be sold with or without the oil cooler

I have done both but now have the DHM setup and no bar at all.

 

[mishimoto1]

Glad you have taken the time to develop this cooler system as well needed, I did my own setup so not needed but others sure can use it!

For track/street cars the stat is a must, also the stock water to oil cooler likely helps bring up oil temps faster than removing the unit but taking it out saves weight and allows more room for a larger oil filter which I highly recommend.

NOTE: It would be a great idea to drill big holes in the stock crash sensor bar as it is of a very restrictive design blocking much of the airflow to the coolers.

OR: Mishimoto, build a replacement with much better airflow, an easy and effective part that could be sold with or without the oil cooler

I have done both but now have the DHM setup and no bar at all.

Thanks for the input Raam! Agreed, the thermostatic setup is definitely recommended for most customers. A high percentage of our oil cooler core is positioned above the crash beam and should have no problems in terms of airflow. This is supported by the results we saw during our data collection. That being said, the beam is massive and certainly blocks flow to the radiator, which is likely making a huge impact on temperatures during track situations. Definitely passing this project idea on to our team for some further evaluation.

Thanks!
-John

 

[RAAMaudio]

John,

To be more clear I was referring to the crash sensor mount sits behind your oil cooler, it is of a very restrictive design and I cannot imagine why it was made that way. Being nearly two inches tall and leading edges that disrupt the air flow around it makes no sense at all.

I made one from 1/2" tubing that also was my oil cooler mount at the time.

As for the bumper beam I have notched the stock one, removed the backing off the full grill, etc....but the beam was a lot of work to do, I would rather drill 3" holes in it and slide in thin wall pipe and weld them in to maintain the strength and allow airflow through the tubes if I ever did it again.

 

[Chuckable]

John,

To be more clear I was referring to the crash sensor mount sits behind your oil cooler, it is of a very restrictive design and I cannot imagine why it was made that way. Being nearly two inches tall and leading edges that disrupt the air flow around it makes no sense at all.

I made one from 1/2" tubing that also was my oil cooler mount at the time.

As for the bumper beam I have notched the stock one, removed the backing off the full grill, etc....but the beam was a lot of work to do, I would rather drill 3" holes in it and slide in thin wall pipe and weld them in to maintain the strength and allow airflow through the tubes if I ever did it again.

I was thinking of doing the same thing, but imagine with the Mishimoto oil cooler and radiator there may be no need to modify the factory crash beam

Maybe it makes no difference to most enthusiasts who are modding their vehicles, but we should at least be aware that modifying a factory front crash structure on a street vehicle is risking liability issues if the vehicle is ever involved in a front end accident. I'm not saying anything negative about DHM's crash bar at all. In fact, I've already spoken to Russ as well as a mechanical engineer about this issue. Rather, I'm just putting it out there on the forum as a means of discussion. I'm imagining a future lawsuit where the lawyer is holding up the OEM warranty which warns against modifications and has an exclusion of liability clause

 

[westcoaST]

If the DHM crash bar is structurally equivalent to the OEM crash bar, and this can be proven by either analysis or testing, then there is no liability or liability would need to be proven. Examination of crashed Fiesta STs shows that these crash bars are energy absorption devices which crumple on contact, I suspect that the DHM crash bar would behave similarly.

See the Magnuson Moss Warranty act for limits on modifications.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnuson–Moss_Warranty_Act

 

[Chuckable]

If the DHM crash bar is structurally equivalent to the OEM crash bar, and this can be proven by either analysis or testing, then there is no liability or liability would need to be proven. Examination of crashed Fiesta STs shows that these crash bars are energy absorption devices which crumple on contact, I suspect that the DHM crash bar would behave similarly.

See the Magnuson Moss Warranty act for limits on modifications.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnuson–Moss_Warranty_Act

I am by no means an expert on the Act, but I did practice in that area for 2 years out of law school. People on forums often bring up the Act when modifications are mentioned, which makes sense. But in the real world, is anyone likely to spend tens of thousands of dollars on a lawsuit plus who knows how much to hire an expert witness plus who knows how much to do crash testing on an aftermarket crash bar? It's just not going to happen.

From speaking to a mechanical engineer friend of mine, the OEM crash bar and the chromoly crash bars are likely to perform differently in high and low speed impacts. Ford designed the rest of the crash structure with the OEM bar in place, and I imagine that re-engineering the crash structure is beyond the ability of all but Tier 1 suppliers. With that said, I'd still love to rock one of Russ' crash bars

Anyway, I don't want to go off topic. To bring it back on topic, I doubt that Mishimoto will modify the OEM crash bar out of concern for liability. That's my 0.02 cents, and it's worth exactly that.

 

[westcoaST]

Both crash bars connect to the same points on the frame. In a front end impact, the crash bar crumples and passes the forces into the frame. There may be more deflection in a low speed crash, but I believe in a high speed crash, both cars would be totaled. FYI, I am an expert witness. Finite element analysis, and loading of both crash bars with strain gages would provide an answer to the crash worthiness of both designs. I've helped other vendors in the past to solve their problems. Mostly in the 2011 -2014 mustangs. More than likely, the insurance company would be the company that the difficulties would arise when making a claim, and they would have to prove that your modification resulted in more damage than an OEM crash bar would. I fought an insurance company in my teens when I was going to Don Bosco Technical Institute for Metallurgical Engineering, and proceeded to prove to them that an earlier accident that involved an uninsured car smashing into my 124 sport spider in the rear was related to a later failure in the ring and pinion gears in my rear end. I got power of attorney from my mom and won the case out of court. My point is, this type of thing can be done, and as long as there is no loss of life, insurance companies have been more than willing to settle. Most people think it's going to cost lots of money and lots of time, and that's exactly what the insurance companies want you to think. I've had little problem convincing them to pay non injury claims for myself and others who have used me as an expert witness. The Magnuson Moss act does work.

 

[Joszer]

Thanks for the input Raam! Agreed, the thermostatic setup is definitely recommended for most customers. A high percentage of our oil cooler core is positioned above the crash beam and should have no problems in terms of airflow. This is supported by the results we saw during our data collection. That being said, the beam is massive and certainly blocks flow to the radiator, which is likely making a huge impact on temperatures during track situations. Definitely passing this project idea on to our team for some further evaluation.

Thanks!
-John

Hey John I just placed my order for both the oil cooler and the catch can, any chance of doing a promotion for those that preorder all 3 R&D products? (catch can, oil cooler, and radiator)

Thanks.

 

[Chuckable]

Hey John I just placed my order for both the oil cooler and the catch can, any chance of doing a promotion for those that preorder all 3 R&D products? (catch can, oil cooler, and radiator)

Thanks.

I like that idea, too! But I saw Mishimoto in another thread saying that they wouldn't be doing a 3-for-1. Hope I'm wrong!

 

[mishimoto1]

John,
To be more clear I was referring to the crash sensor mount sits behind your oil cooler, it is of a very restrictive design and I cannot imagine why it was made that way. Being nearly two inches tall and leading edges that disrupt the air flow around it makes no sense at all.
I made one from 1/2" tubing that also was my oil cooler mount at the time.

As for the bumper beam I have notched the stock one, removed the backing off the full grill, etc....but the beam was a lot of work to do, I would rather drill 3" holes in it and slide in thin wall pipe and weld them in to maintain the strength and allow airflow through the tubes if I ever did it again.

Sorry about that, just ran out to the car to take a second look at the piece you are referring to. The tie bar for the sensors is nearly 2? wide, blocking a good sized portion of the heat exchanger stack. I like your idea of replacing this with a thinner piece of material. Although it might not make a huge difference, I think we are finding that every bit of additional airflow is going to help with the FIST.

I was thinking of doing the same thing, but imagine with the Mishimoto oil cooler and radiator there may be no need to modify the factory crash beam

Maybe it makes no difference to most enthusiasts who are modding their vehicles, but we should at least be aware that modifying a factory front crash structure on a street vehicle is risking liability issues if the vehicle is ever involved in a front end accident. I'm not saying anything negative about DHM's crash bar at all. In fact, I've already spoken to Russ as well as a mechanical engineer about this issue. Rather, I'm just putting it out there on the forum as a means of discussion. I'm imagining a future lawsuit where the lawyer is holding up the OEM warranty which warns against modifications and has an exclusion of liability clause

If the DHM crash bar is structurally equivalent to the OEM crash bar, and this can be proven by either analysis or testing, then there is no liability or liability would need to be proven. Examination of crashed Fiesta STs shows that these crash bars are energy absorption devices which crumple on contact, I suspect that the DHM crash bar would behave similarly.

See the Magnuson Moss Warranty act for limits on modifications.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnuson–Moss_Warranty_Act

I am by no means an expert on the Act, but I did practice in that area for 2 years out of law school. People on forums often bring up the Act when modifications are mentioned, which makes sense. But in the real world, is anyone likely to spend tens of thousands of dollars on a lawsuit plus who knows how much to hire an expert witness plus who knows how much to do crash testing on an aftermarket crash bar? It's just not going to happen.

From speaking to a mechanical engineer friend of mine, the OEM crash bar and the chromoly crash bars are likely to perform differently in high and low speed impacts. Ford designed the rest of the crash structure with the OEM bar in place, and I imagine that re-engineering the crash structure is beyond the ability of all but Tier 1 suppliers. With that said, I'd still love to rock one of Russ' crash bars

Anyway, I don't want to go off topic. To bring it back on topic, I doubt that Mishimoto will modify the OEM crash bar out of concern for liability. That's my 0.02 cents, and it's worth exactly that.

Thanks guys! As noted both our radiator and oil cooler setup will be designed to function with the factory crash beam. In addition, our intercooler R&D thus far is also retaining the stock beam. We always attempt to retain factory components when possible, especially on newer vehicles. That being said, we do include a replacement crash beam within our Subaru WRX/STi FMIC kits. Our beam is constructed from a rigid steel material and is designed to function in a similar manner to the stock setup. On the older WRX/STi models, a lot of folks actually remove the beam completely, however we never recommend doing so which is why we include a replacement in our kits.

I will definitely be passing this recommendation on to our engineering team. If we could design a beam for improved airflow and prove its effectiveness for cooling efficiency, I think we would be even closer to solving the FIST temperature concerns.

Hey John I just placed my order for both the oil cooler and the catch can, any chance of doing a promotion for those that preorder all 3 R&D products? (catch can, oil cooler, and radiator)
Thanks.

I like that idea, too! But I saw Mishimoto in another thread saying that they wouldn't be doing a 3-for-1. Hope I'm wrong!

Thanks for the order Joszer! It is unlikely we will be offering any additional discounts for combined product orders. We will be running a pre-sale for each noted product, although the radiator will be a bit further down the line (still in R&D).

Thanks!
-John