California Smog check

[VeceI]

So far I’ve only upgraded the intake exhaust and intercooler when it comes to power, next on the list is a s280 and a tune, Ik with the cobb access port you can switch tunes to help pass smog, but my main question is will you be able to pass cali smog with a stock tun on a s280?

 

[Mikey456]

It’s been talked about before. You would probably be risking your motor and/or causing a check engine light. If you want to do it I would become handy swapping turbos or getting ready to pay high labor rates to have someone do it for you. IMHO

 

[Gone in 60]

One of the discussions is here:
https://www.fiestastforum.com/threa...og-check-with-a-tune.29690/page-3#post-487348

 

[Dpro]

It’s been talked about before. You would probably be risking your motor and/or causing a check engine light. If you want to do it I would become handy swapping turbos or getting ready to pay high labor rates to have someone do it for you. IMHO

If he goes to a COBB carb legal stage tune and keeps his boost low he will not drop a check engine light or risk anything. The only reason you would get a check engine light with a s280 is if you go aftermarket downpipe which either does not come with a cat or has a 200 cell high flow cat that does not get warm enough to due to flow to trigger the o2 sensor which is the exact engine light and code one would get. Ask me how I know? Plus my Turbo does not get to maximum. boost till around 3200-3400 rpm . So if he drives like a granny and shifts at 3k he will be just fine for the 50 or so miles to get his ready codes and go to smog. The only thing he could have a problem with is nosy smog guys which you seemed to have managed to stumble across Ya don’t take your car to a chain shop . Seek out the individual shops Who look at your car like ordinary other newer cars and just plugs it in reads and glances over your under hood. They are out there.

So ya can it work sure, is there a slight smog guy could get nosy sure. Worst that comes of that is he tells you he can’t smog it till parts are changed oh and hopefully he is not a dick who fails you and send it’s to Sac.

P.S. Turbo swap rates are not that bad it’s a relatively easy job . In fact it’s cheaper than a clutch job on our cars by around 50% less

Again ask me how I know. In fact it’s such an easy job when I adjusted my wastegate I was like damn I could done the Turbo myself. Oh ya the swap was that cheap that I elected to have someone do it along with a dyno tune. ( we don’t talk about the dyno tune lol )

 

[Mikey456]

If he goes to a COBB carb legal stage tune and keeps his boost low he will not drop a check engine light or risk anything. The only reason you would get a check engine light with a s280 is if you go aftermarket downpipe which either does not come with a cat or has a 200 cell high flow cat that does not get warm enough to due to flow to trigger the o2 sensor which is the exact engine light and code one would get. Ask me how I know? Plus my Turbo does not get to maximum. boost till around 3200-3400 rpm . So if he drives like a granny and shifts at 3k he will be just fine for the 50 or so miles to get his ready codes and go to smog. The only thing he could have a problem with is nosy smog guys which you seemed to have managed to stumble across Ya don’t take your car to a chain shop . Seek out the individual shops Who look at your car like ordinary other newer cars and just plugs it in reads and glances over your under hood. They are out there.

So ya can it work sure, is there a slight smog guy could get nosy sure. Worst that comes of that is he tells you he can’t smog it till parts are changed oh and hopefully he is not a dick who fails you and send it’s to Sac.

P.S. Turbo swap rates are not that bad it’s a relatively easy job . In fact it’s cheaper than a clutch job on our cars by around 50% less

Again ask me how I know. In fact it’s such an easy job when I adjusted my wastegate I was like damn I could done the Turbo myself. Oh ya the swap was that cheap that I elected to have someone do it along with a dyno tune. ( we don’t talk about the dyno tune lol )

It would be nice if someone tested that theory. You have way more experience on the S280. Has anyone on the forum done it? The S280 with Cobb stage 1/2. I think Koozy went back to a standard turbo with stage 3 tune?? Anyway have you tried running stage 1/2 for kicks and giggles (granny shifting etc. )?You will be one of the last to bring your car in for a smog. Lucky you[emoji1] I will have to go the dealer or overwrite with another accessport like D-resonant.

 

[Dpro]

It would be nice if someone tested that theory. You have way more experience on the S280. Has anyone on the forum done it? The S280 with Cobb stage 1/2. I think Koozy went back to a standard turbo with stage 3 tune?? Anyway have you tried running stage 1/2 for kicks and giggles (granny shifting etc. )?You will be one of the last to bring your car in for a smog. Lucky you[emoji1] I will have to go the dealer or overwrite with another accessport like D-resonant.

Well Koozy had a 2860 Gen 2 DHM setup that was pretty obviously not stock . He went back to stock before the smog because he felt his setup would not even make it beyond visual. He was also considering selling his car at the time due to another issue. He has since changed his mind about that.
I know you love to doubt and I get you may not grok the basic common sense when understanding how a engine runs. A Cobb Stage 1 or 2 is kinda like running a base tune. Of course you not having anything beyond stock turbo might not understand that. D-Resonant has it even easier because he is running a S242 which is a hybrid based on the KP39 frame so outside of his Mountune Sportcat like mine it looks totally stock. He also has the same CARB E.O.’d COBB intake that I have.
If he needs to get another AP it’s because he elects to do that rather than updating his AP for the sake of the CARB legal COBB tunes . His Tune+ tune for his S242 will not magicslly disappear . He got a second AP in the past because he used to A Mountune 215 and MR230 tune before he went big Turbo.

 

[New_Daily]

Well Koozy had a 2860 Gen 2 DHM setup that was pretty obviously not stock . He went back to stock before the smog because he felt his setup would not even make it beyond visual. He was also considering selling his car at the time due to another issue. He has since changed his mind about that.
I know you love to doubt and I get you may not grok the basic common sense when understanding how a engine runs. A Cobb Stage 1 or 2 is kinda like running a base tune. Of course you not having anything beyond stock turbo might not understand that. D-Resonant has it even easier because he is running a S242 which is a hybrid based on the KP39 frame so outside of his Mountune Sportcat like mine it looks totally stock. He also has the same CARB E.O.’d COBB intake that I have.
If he needs to get another AP it’s because he elects to do that rather than updating his AP for the sake of the CARB legal COBB tunes . His Tune+ tune for his S242 will not magicslly disappear . He got a second AP in the past because he used to A Mountune 215 and MR230 tune before he went big Turbo.

I have a few questions here

It was my understanding that the Cobb Stage 0 tune was "essentially" a stock tune (ie very close or equal to the Ford tune in terms of actual values but maybe different in the traction control or something like that). However for the purposes of smog, the check station would still be able to tell the difference between ANY Cobb tune (stage 0,1,2,3, other atermarket etc) and the stock tune. So we can theoretically get the CARB cert for our tunes from Cobb, and be legal, but as seen in other threads here, especially if we bought an AP second hand, that may prove difficult actually getting it from Cobb.

So, that would leave us CA folks with the option of uninstalling the AP, and reverting back to the actual Ford stock tune, and driving very very carefully. But the issue with this is, while the smog station may be very close, and relatively easy to drive easy to get there, we still have to worry about our system getting into full readiness state, which could take 200 miles of mixed scenario driving?

On the issue of the Cobb system update with the new smog controls: I haven't plugged my AP in to update it since those changes came out. I know my Dizzy tune will still be there, but won't the updates from Cobb cause some issue with the Dizzy tune that was created before these updates? Does Dizzy (or any other tuner) need to provide an updated file to be compatible with the AP after you get the most recent update?

 

[Darkflamedesign]

(California)
Just got smogged on DIZZY 2 tune - passed readiness check etc.
It was a STAR station too. They mostly tripped on visual. But I ” changed “ it a bit let’s say - without pulling intake.
They didn’t ask for Cobb EO ( even had access port in cradle ) - just unplugged for obd read.

 

[New_Daily]

(California)
Just got smogged on DIZZY 2 tune - passed readiness check etc.
It was a STAR station too. They mostly tripped on visual. But I ” changed “ it a bit let’s say - without pulling intake.
They didn’t ask for Cobb EO ( even had access port in cradle ) - just unplugged for obd read.

Ok wait! Unless this isn't new, and I've been under a rock, this is big (good) news. You're saying you had your Dizzy tune, loaded and running on your car, and you passed everything no prob, with a small exception for some visual issues with your intake?!

 

[Dpro]

Ok wait! Unless this isn't new, and I've been under a rock, this is big (good) news. You're saying you had your Dizzy tune, loaded and running on your car, and you passed everything no prob, with a small exception for some visual issues with your intake?!

I have a few questions here

It was my understanding that the Cobb Stage 0 tune was "essentially" a stock tune (ie very close or equal to the Ford tune in terms of actual values but maybe different in the traction control or something like that). However for the purposes of smog, the check station would still be able to tell the difference between ANY Cobb tune (stage 0,1,2,3, other atermarket etc) and the stock tune. So we can theoretically get the CARB cert for our tunes from Cobb, and be legal, but as seen in other threads here, especially if we bought an AP second hand, that may prove difficult actually getting it from Cobb.

So, that would leave us CA folks with the option of uninstalling the AP, and reverting back to the actual Ford stock tune, and driving very very carefully. But the issue with this is, while the smog station may be very close, and relatively easy to drive easy to get there, we still have to worry about our system getting into full readiness state, which could take 200 miles of mixed scenario driving?

On the issue of the Cobb system update with the new smog controls: I haven't plugged my AP in to update it since those changes came out. I know my Dizzy tune will still be there, but won't the updates from Cobb cause some issue with the Dizzy tune that was created before these updates? Does Dizzy (or any other tuner) need to provide an updated file to be compatible with the AP after you get the most recent update?

The COBB stage 1&2 are essentially SMOG legal tunes with a sticker if needed . I would never take my AP or have it plugged in when going to a SMOG tech. It’s not what is needed to prove your tune is legal and most likely would just make a lot of smog techs more suspicious. Koozy passed on a COB stage tune as well. As long as your tune does not trigger any sensors then you will pass. Yes there has been lots of talk of being able to check and see if you have flashed before thing is disconnecting and reconnecting your battery will reset your readiness which is how they check to see if it’s flashed. No one try‘s to get a smog check with readiness flags not cleared. You are allowed one readiness flag as well. The latter sentence came right of my Smog check friends mouth.
COBB tunes will not mess with your Dizzy tunes, Tune+ tunes or any other as you can only flash one tune to your ECU at a time so it clears out the other tune that was on their. Your tunes are stored in your AP and you can flash between them.
You should be able to achieve readiness with less than 200 miles of driving average is 50-100. Does not need to be mixed scenario. In fact I have seen smog guys run cars on the dyno for awhile to get readiness lights off.

 

[New_Daily]

The COBB stage 1&2 are essentially SMOG legal tunes with a sticker if needed . I would never take my AP or have it plugged in when going to a SMOG tech. It’s not what is needed to prove your tune is legal and most likely would just make a lot of smog techs more suspicious. Koozy passed on a COB stage tune as well. As long as your tune does not trigger any sensors then you will pass. Yes there has been lots of talk of being able to check and see if you have flashed before thing is disconnecting and reconnecting your battery will reset your readiness which is how they check to see if it’s flashed. No one try‘s to get a smog check with readiness flags not cleared. You are allowed one readiness flag as well. The latter sentence came right of my Smog check friends mouth.
COBB tunes will not mess with your Dizzy tunes, Tune+ tunes or any other as you can only flash one tune to your ECU at a time so it clears out the other tune that was on their. Your tunes are stored in your AP and you can flash between them.
You should be able to achieve readiness with less than 200 miles of driving average is 50-100. Does not need to be mixed scenario. In fact I have seen smog guys run cars on the dyno for awhile to get readiness lights off.

Yeah I wasn't giddy about the fact that he kept his AP in the car, just that he had his Dizzy tune running the car and it did not present a problem for smog.

I realize the Cobb tunes wont mess with other (Dizzy, Tune+) tunes, I thought that updating the firmware on the AP its self would mess with existing aftermarket tunes, because the firmware update puts locks on the ability of tuners to disable some emissions controls, and those tune would now be in conflict with the controls on the AP......?

And, I mean really, whether its a Cobb OTS stage 0-3 tune doesn't really matter for those with aftermarket turbos. Either way, those OTS Cobb tunes will not correctly run the engine for the flow of the aftermarket turbo, so it's not like any of those would be any safer to load to smog your car than the factory Ford tune. So, if what @Darkflamedesign is saying is true, and you can just have an aftermarket tune loaded and not trip the smog station's computer, then the only worry is the visual. An S280 obviously looks substantially different than the stock turbo, but maybe just maybe since its tucked back behind the engine, and if you have the stock crossover pipe and intake, you wont trip any mental alarm bells on the dudes doing testing and we can pass in CA without actually having to change a tune or worse yet, swap back to the stock turbo temporarily.

 

[Dpro]

Yeah I wasn't giddy about the fact that he kept his AP in the car, just that he had his Dizzy tune running the car and it did not present a problem for smog.

I realize the Cobb tunes wont mess with other (Dizzy, Tune+) tunes, I thought that updating the firmware on the AP its self would mess with existing aftermarket tunes, because the firmware update puts locks on the ability of tuners to disable some emissions controls, and those tune would now be in conflict with the controls on the AP......?

And, I mean really, whether its a Cobb OTS stage 0-3 tune doesn't really matter for those with aftermarket turbos. Either way, those OTS Cobb tunes will not correctly run the engine for the flow of the aftermarket turbo, so it's not like any of those would be any safer to load to smog your car than the factory Ford tune. So, if what @Darkflamedesign is saying is true, and you can just have an aftermarket tune loaded and not trip the smog station's computer, then the only worry is the visual. An S280 obviously looks substantially different than the stock turbo, but maybe just maybe since its tucked back behind the engine, and if you have the stock crossover pipe and intake, you wont trip any mental alarm bells on the dudes doing testing and we can pass in CA without actually having to change a tune or worse yet, swap back to the stock turbo temporarily.

Ok the main thing that was eliminated was the ability to turn off the o2 sensor trigger which lights up the check engine light and spits a code if not getting heated enough. This has already been discussed earlier. Now the next thing that you a few others fail to realize is if your running say a stage 2 tune it’s going to run a richer than stock setting as Ford left a lot on the table with the stock tune to play it safe. So running it at low boost will not be a problem as the S280 on the bottom end flows a lot like a stock turbo again I can take you for a ride and show you. I have no doubt driving it low rpm on a COBB tune for 100 -150 miles would not hurt it. Stay out of boost as much as possible and your fine and yes you could swap your turBo if one was that worried.

You can also run the COBB 3 inch crossover intake setup that D-Resonant and I run. It’s CARB E.O.D. under the same number as the Stage 1 and 2 tune as it’s part of their smog legal package. So Again runs great no need to change. Yes the Turbo is buried under heat shields and unless a Smog tech gets nosy he would not see it.

In the end I think we have discussed this up and down and over again. There really is nothing more to say Beside YMMV.

 

[New_Daily]

Ok the main thing that was eliminated was the ability to turn off the o2 sensor trigger which lights up the check engine light and spits a code if not getting heated enough. This has already been discussed earlier. Now the next thing that you a few others fail to realize is if your running say a stage 2 tune it’s going to run a richer than stock setting as Ford left a lot on the table with the stock tune to play it safe. So running it at low boost will not be a problem as the S280 on the bottom end flows a lot like a stock turbo again I can take you for a ride and show you. I have no doubt driving it low rpm on a COBB tune for 100 -150 miles would not hurt it. Stay out of boost as much as possible and your fine and yes you could swap your turBo if one was that worried.

You can also run the COBB 3 inch crossover intake setup that D-Resonant and I run. It’s CARB E.O.D. under the same number as the Stage 1 and 2 tune as it’s part of their smog legal package. So Again runs great no need to change. Yes the Turbo is buried under heat shields and unless a Smog tech gets nosy he would not see it.

In the end I think we have discussed this up and down and over again. There really is nothing more to say Beside YMMV.

No, I get that at low RPM, low load a Cobb or probably even stock tune will be ok with an S280, that's not my worry. My worry is being able to put 50-100 miles on it without putting my foot in it.

And yes, I know the Cobb intakes (which include a new crossover) are CARB legal. That's why that particular intake is the one I want if I get one.

But until @Darkflamedesign 's post above, I didn't think you could pass CA smog with ANY aftermarket tune, except the Cobb and then you have to get the CARB proof from Cobb. Other than that, I thought it was factory Ford tune, in full readiness state, period end of story.

 

[Dpro]

No, I get that at low RPM, low load a Cobb or probably even stock tune will be ok with an S280, that's not my worry. My worry is being able to put 50-100 miles on it without putting my foot in it.

And yes, I know the Cobb intakes (which include a new crossover) are CARB legal. That's why that particular intake is the one I want if I get one.

But until @Darkflamedesign 's post above, I didn't think you could pass CA smog with ANY aftermarket tune, except the Cobb and then you have to get the CARB proof from Cobb. Other than that, I thought it was factory Ford tune, in full readiness state, period end of story.

Ya Koozy had already proved passing with the COBB stage 3 tune which is not CARB legal and they guy did not even ask to see his COBB E.O. sticker on his door panel. I put mine on the underside of my Hood so I could point to it if needed. lol

Moral of this story is pick your smog guy carefully go mom and pop yes Star stations can be mom and pop don’t use Costco, pepboys Firestone etc….

 

[Mikey456]

Well Koozy had a 2860 Gen 2 DHM setup that was pretty obviously not stock . He went back to stock before the smog because he felt his setup would not even make it beyond visual. He was also considering selling his car at the time due to another issue. He has since changed his mind about that.
I know you love to doubt and I get you may not grok the basic common sense when understanding how a engine runs. A Cobb Stage 1 or 2 is kinda like running a base tune. Of course you not having anything beyond stock turbo might not understand that. D-Resonant has it even easier because he is running a S242 which is a hybrid based on the KP39 frame so outside of his Mountune Sportcat like mine it looks totally stock. He also has the same CARB E.O.’d COBB intake that I have.
If he needs to get another AP it’s because he elects to do that rather than updating his AP for the sake of the CARB legal COBB tunes . His Tune+ tune for his S242 will not magicslly disappear . He got a second AP in the past because he used to A Mountune 215 and MR230 tune before he went big Turbo.

No doubt I’m skeptical. I like proven facts. Koozy proved you can pass with a tune. D-resonate proved that you can overwrite the MP215 tune with Cobb accessport tune The unknown: passing Smog with big turbo. Good luck (not being sarcastic) with your turbo. But I’m sure it would nice to hear from someone that has passed recently with a big turbo. Wouldn’t you agree?

 

[Darkflamedesign]

Ok wait! Unless this isn't new, and I've been under a rock, this is big (good) news. You're saying you had your Dizzy tune, loaded and running on your car, and you passed everything no prob, with a small exception for some visual issues with your intake?!

I am saying absolutely true , recently, like dec. 26.
I did not mention any tune , let the guy do his precheck and test.
Car was on 93 plus a little Lucas octane but pretty much as is. My car is low mileage too for a 2014 ( 32000 ) but the visual is what stopped him originally. Believe it or not that ingen will pass too. I just had to “ correct “ the look of things.

I think if I went big turbo , new fuel rails and all that … I probably would be in a fix. But it’s the stupid cold air intake that catches their eye. Out here , more issue with loud pipes and cops - thanks to the idiot DODGE BOYS running drags on the 91 fwy.

 

[New_Daily]

I am saying absolutely true , recently, like dec. 26.
I did not mention any tune , let the guy do his precheck and test.
Car was on 93 plus a little Lucas octane but pretty much as is. My car is low mileage too for a 2014 ( 32000 ) but the visual is what stopped him originally. Believe it or not that ingen will pass too. I just had to “ correct “ the look of things.

I think if I went big turbo , new fuel rails and all that … I probably would be in a fix. But it’s the stupid cold air intake that catches their eye. Out here , more issue with loud pipes and cops - thanks to the idiot DODGE BOYS running drags on the 91 fwy.

Yes you didn’t say any tune, but aside from the Cobb tunes which are covered under a CARB EO number, I’m pretty sure all aftermarket tunes would be the same in the eyes of smog testers and their equipment.

 

[New_Daily]

No doubt I’m skeptical. I like proven facts. Koozy proved you can pass with a tune. D-resonate proved that you can overwrite the MP215 tune with Cobb accessport tune The unknown: passing Smog with big turbo. Good luck (not being sarcastic) with your turbo. But I’m sure it would nice to hear from someone that has passed recently with a big turbo. Wouldn’t you agree?

Well sure it would be a nice anecdote to see someone pass with a BT, but it would be very situational. The turbo its elf just hanging off the motor would be subject to the visual test, and every tester is going to be different.

What I think is important is that the stations can plug in their systems and if we don’t fail just by virtue of having an aftermarket tune, then we’re in a much better position (at least better than I had thought). Because passing according to their computer is completely objective. The visuals are always subjective based on individual testers.

 

[Dpro]

Well sure it would be a nice anecdote to see someone pass with a BT, but it would be very situational. The turbo its elf just hanging off the motor would be subject to the visual test, and every tester is going to be different.

What I think is important is that the stations can plug in their systems and if we don’t fail just by virtue of having an aftermarket tune, then we’re in a much better position (at least better than I had thought). Because passing according to their computer is completely objective. The visuals are always subjective based on individual testers.

You finally get it and what Mikey seems to be missing the fact that at next to low boost or no boost the car can run a mild tune with a bigger turbo. I should add the S280 is a larger turbo but not that much larger. It was based off a 2 liter 4 cylinder turbo frame with a bigger wheel so ya it flows more air when you wind it up but at low boost it’s runs and flows like stock. I know this because of how my car drives around tune and how and when my boost really starts to kick in. He is skeptical without experience and I am pretty sure a pessimist at heart given he challenges a lot of posts not just smog with a good amount of skepticism.

 

[New_Daily]

You finally get it and what Mikey seems to be missing the fact that at next to low boost or no boost the car can run a mild tune with a bigger turbo. I should add the S280 is a larger turbo but not that much larger. It was based off a 2 liter 4 cylinder turbo frame with a bigger wheel so ya it flows more air when you wind it up but at low boost it’s runs and flows like stock. I know this because of how my car drives around tune and how and when my boost really starts to kick in. He is skeptical without experience and I am pretty sure a pessimist at heart given he challenges a lot of posts not just smog with a good amount of skepticism.

Ive always understood the mechanism and nature of how the actual turbo would or would or would not pass (visual). And I’ve also always understood you can run a stock tune with many turbos at low rpm and low load. My question was always the pass / fail nature of the tune it’s self. Reverting back to stock tune is easy, but for me the worry was putting those miles on the car to get to readiness state without putting my foot on it. I’d be borderline paranoid of getting in some situation where I needed a quick speed burst and boom, because the stock tune cant properly control boost on a larger (or different than stock) turbo under boost and can’t properly deliver fuel when the fuel and boost maps don’t match what the turbo is putting out.

To get further in the weeds, it seems like what you’re saying is that the only thing even the most new smog computers check for is simple emissions readiness and just having an aftermarket tune won’t necessarily put it into a state of non readiness?