Big brake kits BBK’s

[jeffreylyon]

Noting this, I just ordered some BP20s for street use... but if they can double duty for the track, that would make me happy. Otherwise I was going to ppt for some Gloc R10s

I like the BP-20s for the track but they work well only once you get some decent heat into them. Take a look at the PolyMatrix-E if you're looking for a more street/track pad; when my FiST saw more street use I ran them to save me the hassle of a pad swap.

 

[Fusion Works]

Weird, MY BP20s feel just like the stock pads even when its 30deg outside and I melted them on track at Barber. The BP20 is a good street/ light track pad. Probably lean more towards autox, but it depends heavily on driver. I am murder on my brakes, (why not). HAHA. I have a customer that runs a 03 ACura CL Type S that I built a similar sized kit for and he has no issues at all with the BP20 on track. His car weighs 3200 with him in it and mine is 2950 with me in it. We make about the same torque, but mine only makes 187whp right now to his 250ish. Plus he has a 255 tire vs my 215.

 

[Economatic]

I like the BP-20s for the track but they work well only once you get some decent heat into them. Take a look at the PolyMatrix-E if you're looking for a more street/track pad; when my FiST saw more street use I ran them to save me the hassle of a pad swap.

Polymatrix E H is the pad I tried with my off the shelf Wilwood kit and I did not like them at all. The initial bite was way too much for me and I had a hard time modulating the brakes on the track. Street driving was just as bad where you'd nearly send your passenger through the windshield if you forgot how touchy the brakes were. I got a few angry looks from my wife about that...and I returned the favor when she drove home after one of my track days. Those pads were also really noisy so I wouldn't run them on a daily basis for that reason alone. I'm curious why our experiences were so different...

 

[jeffreylyon]

Weird, MY BP20s feel just like the stock pads even when its 30deg outside and I melted them on track at Barber. The BP20 is a good street/ light track pad. Probably lean more towards autox, but it depends heavily on driver. I am murder on my brakes, (why not). HAHA. I have a customer that runs a 03 ACura CL Type S that I built a similar sized kit for and he has no issues at all with the BP20 on track. His car weighs 3200 with him in it and mine is 2950 with me in it. We make about the same torque, but mine only makes 187whp right now to his 250ish. Plus he has a 255 tire vs my 215.

At PittRace there are 3 big brake zones with decent cools off zone between and it's very fair to assume that you're a better late braker than I am. My experience with the BP-10's is similar to what you're describing re. the BP-20's; I have a picture of of me in the middle of a brake zone, throwing sparks off the fronts during an easy lap.

 

[jeffreylyon]

Polymatrix E is the pad I tried with my off the shelf Wilwood kit and I did not like them at all. The initial bite was way too much for me and I had a hard time modulating the brakes on the track. Street driving was just as bad where you'd nearly send your passenger through the windshield if you forgot how touchy the brakes were. I got a few angry looks from my wife about that...and I returned the favor when she drove home after one of my track days. Those pads were also really noisy so I wouldn't run them on a daily basis for that reason alone. I'm curious why our experiences were so different...

Probably because our expectations are different. My wife won't ride with me in the FiST b/c she thinks that I drive like an asshole, bitey brakes or not...

 

[Fusion Works]

Glad I'm not the only one whose wife won't ride with them. HAHA.

I would love to see the pic of the brakes throwing sparks. Yep, I am the worst of the late brakers. One time at RD Atlanta, in a Chump race, me and this Civic were side by side all the way down the straight. We we both so low powered we couldn't pass. I remember looking at him as he hit the brakes and I just waited. Nailed the brakes and just barely slid off into the gravel. Oops, too late. HAHA

 

[Economatic]

Probably because our expectations are different. My wife won't ride with me in the FiST b/c she thinks that I drive like an asshole, bitey brakes or not...

Hahaha! My wife actually gets mad at me when I drive the fun cars without her. And she's been constantly disappointed that the track I go to doesn't allow ride alongs.

FWIW, the Wilwoods with BP-10 pads and blank rotors, 12'' rear rotors with stock pads, and SS lines all around are excellent on the street. The pedal feel is great and on par with a couple other cars I've had with overpriced BBKs. I've got a set of BP-30 pads on the way for my next track day so that will be the true test of my setup.

 

[Ford ST]

No point in arguing with someone that doesn't understand if you can lock up the tires with the brakes you have you have overcame the tires ability to grip.

I don't care what brakes you have on the car if you can lock up the tires better brakes are not going to improve stopping time only better tires.
Better tires put more heat in the brakes the stock brakes will get overheated and they don't work so well when they are hot as fire. Bigger brakes are about heat.
There is a reason if you look at stopping distances of cars why they are all so darn similar. The vehicles that have better stopping distances have better tires and weigh less.

This is simply a fact.

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[jeffreylyon]

I gave a real world comparison to both systems I have had on my car. There is no placebo effect dink.

What makes you think I was referring to you?

 

[TyphoonFiST]

No point in arguing with someone that doesn't understand if you can lock up the tires with the brakes you have you have overcame the tires ability to grip.

I don't care what brakes you have on the car if you can lock up the tires better brakes are not going to improve stopping time only better tires.
Better tires put more heat in the brakes the stock brakes will get overheated and they don't work so well when they are hot as fire. Bigger brakes are about heat.
There is a reason if you look at stopping distances of cars why they are all so darn similar. The vehicles that have better stopping distances have better tires and weigh less.

This is simply a fact.

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I will totally agree with you here...Tire or Tyres are single handedly the most important part in stopping your car! You could have the Best BBK and some mediocre tires but in the end, Your brakes are as only good as your tires.

 

[Ford ST]

I will totally agree with you here...Tire or Tyres are single handedly the most important part in stopping your car! You could have the Best BBK and some mediocre tires but in the end, Your brakes are as only good as your tires.

Only if we could run some Michelin sport cup 2 tires.

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[Ford ST]

Are those better than Direzza ZIII's? No way in hell they are.

Yes they are. They are some of the best tires ever made.


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[jeffreylyon]

Lol because you quoted me Dr Mindbender

I used a 3rd person pronoun in that last paragraph. Maybe you just identify with what I suggested.

Remind me, how many months between the time that you dropped off your car for a bunch of mods and picked it up. Weeks? Months? You must have a really good memory to be able to judge the difference between brake setups with such a pause in between.

 

[jeffreylyon]

Are those better than Direzza ZIII's? No way in hell they are.

I betcha that I know what tires you're running!

 

[TyphoonFiST]

Good article.....

https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a10316984/why-braking-is-all-about-tires/

 

[Ford ST]

You're running the Michelins or are you talking doody again?

It's obvious you don't believe in engineering test results numbers statistics and so forth.
we can't run those tires because they don't make them for are car. They use them on cars like the Porsche 911 GT3 and Ferraris and such.
I could post the test results for your tires, but you wouldn't believe those numbers or test results.

I believe in science you seem to believe in nonsense. I don't care if you put brakes on your car from a Lamborghini Aventador they cannot make your car stop faster.

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[Ford ST]

Just one example of the tires that you think are so great.
Michelin sport cup 2 tires are in a different league than all four of those.

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[Woods247]

Why would anyone run shitty tires with a BBK? Certainly everyone here understands grip lol.

I still wish I’d installed the LSD first. I wonder if the car would even need a brake swap with a LSD. Torque Vectoring was cooking my brakes more than actual braking. The LSD limits TV a lot.

 

[Fusion Works]

Ignore is such a cool feature. HAHA

 

[M-Sport fan]

Yes they are. They are some of the best tires ever made.


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Given that most of the Pilot Sport Cup 2 tires carry either a 140 or 180 tread wear rating, and because of that cannot even be used for SCCA whatever/Stock competition, I would say YES, there is a pretty good chance that they are stickier than most of the 200 tread wear donuts (even considering the massive tread wear over-rating the manufacturers give them to gain a 'competitive edge').