Bilstein B8 with standard springs

[Rutschpartie]

I would have thought that the Bilstein B8’s with the original ST springs would sit slightly lower than original struts + springs due to the B8 struts being slightly shorter?

not sure about that, standard b6/b8 have different characteristics than stock ST dampers and ive read that b6 with stock springs can raise the ST significant, but you would need to find someone who rly measured this!

 

[Rhys1983]

not sure about that, standard b6/b8 have different characteristics than stock ST dampers and ive read that b6 with stock springs can raise the ST significant, but you would need to find someone who rly measured this!

Ah right! That’s something worth considering then. Ideally I’m just looking for slightly lower than stock as this should keep a good roll centre as well as give the benefits of lowering. At the moment there’s about a finger’s gap between the tyre and arch which seems a bit low to me. I could get a spacer fitted to the top of Eibach springs which would give me another 10mm or so of height increase without any negatives.

 

[Rutschpartie]

Ah right! That’s something worth considering then. Ideally I’m just looking for slightly lower than stock as this should keep a good roll centre as well as give the benefits of lowering. At the moment there’s about a finger’s gap between the tyre and arch which seems a bit low to me. I could get a spacer fitted to the top of Eibach springs which would give me another 10mm or so of height increase without any negatives.

if you also need more wheel clearance this would be a good solution i think

 

[Rhys1983]

if you also need more wheel clearance this would be a good solution i think

It’s mainly to do with the Eibachs sitting slightly too low which are causing the control arms to sit level. I think that fitting a small spacer will solve this issue without causing any negative issues that I’m aware of?
Like you say, fitting original springs could make the car sit too high at the front and I think that the springs are slightly softer which could cause more body roll and weight transfer under braking.

 

[Rutschpartie]

It’s mainly to do with the Eibachs sitting slightly too low which are causing the control arms to sit level. I think that fitting a small spacer will solve this issue without causing any negative issues that I’m aware of?
Like you say, fitting original springs could make the car sit too high at the front and I think that the springs are slightly softer which could cause more body roll and weight transfer under braking.

10mm spring spacer will do no harm to your components, but i dont think it will rly handle a lot better, if you have noticeable bumpsteer or camber change now, it will also be there with the spacer, travel under hard cornering/bumps will be much more than 10mm i think

 

[Rhys1983]

10mm spring spacer will do no harm to your components, but i dont think it will rly handle a lot better, if you have noticeable bumpsteer or camber change now, it will also be there with the spacer, travel under hard cornering/bumps will be much more than 10mm i think

Yes, I guess that minor changes like this won’t really make any difference on the road. The thing is, the car drives really well now. It’s just that if there are improvements to be made then I’d be happy to make changes.
For noticeable changes I think I’d need to go down the coilover route, but I’m not sure if it would work as well for fast road use as our roads in Wales are undulating with a lot of rough tarmac sections so maybe coilovers would be too stiff?
I could save up for some Nitron or Moton-AST coilovers, but not sure if these are more of a track set up.

 

[Dialcaliper]

I would have thought that the Bilstein B8’s with the original ST springs would sit slightly lower than original struts + springs due to the B8 struts being slightly shorter?

The spring perches to knuckle distance on the B8’s are the same height, just the shock body above it where the bumpstops contact and the shock shaft itself is shorter (or else they would lower the car even more than the springs do by themselves). The springs aren’t anywhere near coil bind, so there’s no risk to the shock or spring with the reduced bumpstop height.

 

[M-Sport fan]

Yes, I guess that minor changes like this won’t really make any difference on the road. The thing is, the car drives really well now. It’s just that if there are improvements to be made then I’d be happy to make changes.
For noticeable changes I think I’d need to go down the coilover route, but I’m not sure if it would work as well for fast road use as our roads in Wales are undulating with a lot of rough tarmac sections so maybe coilovers would be too stiff?
I could save up for some Nitron or Moton-AST coilovers, but not sure if these are more of a track set up.

Last time I checked, neither Moton nor Ohlins made anything even close to fitting our rides.
Do you know otherwise?

 

[Rutschpartie]

Last time I checked, neither Moton nor Ohlins made anything even close to fitting our rides.
Do you know otherwise?

for "comfortable" rough road I think your best cheap option is B6 + stock springs? Little higher + softer than stock but still stiffer than a non ST fiesta.

 

[Rhys1983]

Last time I checked, neither Moton nor Ohlins made anything even close to fitting our rides.
Do you know otherwise?

In the Uk Moton are known as AST. They do make coilovers for the St. there’s the 5100 which are one way adjustable and they have a 5300 version which are 3 way adjustable. They cost about £2,200 ($2900) for the 5100 and £4400 ($5500) for the 5300. I’m not sure what ride height or spring rate they are though?

 

[Rutschpartie]

In the Uk Moton are known as AST. They do make coilovers for the St. there’s the 5100 which are one way adjustable and they have a 5300 version which are 3 way adjustable. They cost about £2,200 ($2900) for the 5100 and £4400 ($5500) for the 5300. I’m not sure what ride height or spring rate they are though?

on the homepage they state (5100): lowering 25-60mm so maybe not what you are looking for

 

[Rhys1983]

on the homepage they state (5100): lowering 25-60mm so maybe not what you are looking for

Almost all of the coilover kits seem to be a lowering option. If someone could come up with a compliant, road biased kit which used standard height then it would be great!

 

[kevinatfms]

The Eibach Pro-Kit springs are not stiffer than stock ST spring. Check the spring rates thread. They are super soft and progressively get harder to the final OE rate. I believe this was to increase ride quality at lower speeds.

 

[M-Sport fan]

Almost all of the coilover kits seem to be a lowering option. If someone could come up with a compliant, road biased kit which used standard height then it would be great!

Story of my life with this car, since it seems that we are the ONLY ones who do not want to 'stancer slam' our rides to the ground.

I have confirmed that the Reiger R2 Tarmac kit WILL go even a good bit higher than factory ride height (not all of the paved roads used for the WRC/ERC/etc. are perfectly glass smooth, new pavement!) to slightly lower than that.

But yeah, again that ridiculous price of entry, and I doubt that they could ever be adjusted to be 'cushy' at all, in any way,

 

[Rhys1983]

The Eibach Pro-Kit springs are not stiffer than stock ST spring. Check the spring rates thread. They are super soft and progressively get harder to the final OE rate. I believe this was to increase ride quality at lower speeds.

I’ve checked the spring rate thread. From what I understand, there were two different Eibach pro kit for the fiesta. One was progressive front and back and the other was progressive back and linear front. They were almost identical to the mountune kit. I did speak to a distributor of mountune and Eibach and he said the Eibach and mountune springs look identical with even coil binds in the front so he’s convinced that the mountune springs are a direct copy of the Eibachs! I’ve had a look at my Eibach springs and they’re definitely progressive in the back as confirmed by the different coil spacing, but the front ones look linear with even spacing between the coils. I wander if there were different ones made for US and UK markets? 🤔

 

[esp_martin]

I’ve checked the spring rate thread. From what I understand, there were two different Eibach pro kit for the fiesta. One was progressive front and back and the other was progressive back and linear front. They were almost identical to the mountune kit. I did speak to a distributor of mountune and Eibach and he said the Eibach and mountune springs look identical with even coil binds in the front so he’s convinced that the mountune springs are a direct copy of the Eibachs! I’ve had a look at my Eibach springs and they’re definitely progressive in the back as confirmed by the different coil spacing, but the front ones look linear with even spacing between the coils. I wander if there were different ones made for US and UK markets? 🤔

I think Mountune has stated before that Eibach makes their springs but I can only speak to the US market.

edit: that's not to say they're the same spring; just that Eibach *makes* the Mountune springs.

 

[Rhys1983]

Story of my life with this car, since it seems that we are the ONLY ones who do not want to 'stancer slam' our rides to the ground.

I have confirmed that the Reiger R2 Tarmac kit WILL go even a good bit higher than factory ride height (not all of the paved roads used for the WRC/ERC/etc. are perfectly glass smooth, new pavement!) to slightly lower than that.

But yeah, again that ridiculous price of entry, and I doubt that they could ever be adjusted to be 'cushy' at all, in any way,

The way things are going the reigers will be on before the end of the year! No messing! 😂
I’d imagine they’d be stiff for road use, but would give great control and make the car fun to drive!

 

[Rutschpartie]

The way things are going the reigers will be on before the end of the year! No messing! 😂
I’d imagine they’d be stiff for road use, but would give great control and make the car fun to drive!

crazy...very cool, but crazy (if you are not into stage rallying)

 

[kevinatfms]

I’ve checked the spring rate thread. From what I understand, there were two different Eibach pro kit for the fiesta. One was progressive front and back and the other was progressive back and linear front. They were almost identical to the mountune kit. I did speak to a distributor of mountune and Eibach and he said the Eibach and mountune springs look identical with even coil binds in the front so he’s convinced that the mountune springs are a direct copy of the Eibachs! I’ve had a look at my Eibach springs and they’re definitely progressive in the back as confirmed by the different coil spacing, but the front ones look linear with even spacing between the coils. I wander if there were different ones made for US and UK markets? 🤔

In the US there is only one Eibach Pro-Kit. The "pro" in pro-kit is progressive. They are 100% progressive springs as stated by their website with the starting rate and final rate given. They are never actually stiffer than the OE springs at any point.

From what i remember, the Mountune springs sold in the US are 5% stiffer. They are made by Eibach to Mountune's specs and are linear in rate with the rear "dead" coils used to keep the springs within the pockets. The live coils are all the same wire diameter and spacing.

There could very well be other sets of springs overseas. That i am unsure about. Eibach used to make the "red" springs for alot of EU cars. Dont know if they made them on top of the Pro-Kit springs for the Fiesta? I think they were more aggressive than the pro-kit springs, almost like the Sportline setup here in the US.

 

[Rhys1983]

In the US there is only one Eibach Pro-Kit. The "pro" in pro-kit is progressive. They are 100% progressive springs as stated by their website with the starting rate and final rate given. They are never actually stiffer than the OE springs at any point.

From what i remember, the Mountune springs sold in the US are 5% stiffer. They are made by Eibach to Mountune's specs and are linear in rate with the rear "dead" coils used to keep the springs within the pockets. The live coils are all the same wire diameter and spacing.

There could very well be other sets of springs overseas. That i am unsure about. Eibach used to make the "red" springs for alot of EU cars. Dont know if they made them on top of the Pro-Kit springs for the Fiesta? I think they were more aggressive than the pro-kit springs, almost like the Sportline setup here in the US.

It looks to me like there may well be different Eibach pro springs that were available for the fiesta St.
This is a photo of the ones that I have:

As you can see, these are linear in the front and progressive in the rear. They also look identical to the mountune springs:
I believe that the springs are very similar in spring rate being about 5% stiffer than original springs.
Eibach also offer a redline spring which is 35mm lower in the front and 40-45mm lower at the rear. These would definitely be too low for me!
I’m not sure what rates these springs are, but from reading forums they seem to be softer than the Eibach pro kit.
It looks like there may be different Eibach pro springs in the UK and US market.