Dirty Intake Valves (am I watching too many YouTube videos?)

[weazsel]

The fiesta ST is built to be driven hard.. it needs it's engine to rev pretty hard like 5 - 6k every day or it will have problems any way .. has to be thrashed... Like my old escort with a hot 1.6 xflow...

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Oh good because I beat the balls off my car lol... I'm emptying my catch can this weekend at some point. I'll post a picture.

 

[HardBoiledEgg]

Oh I'm with you guys. It definitely does SOMETHING


I'm sure I have oil in my pipes, but I dare venture you with OCC also do!


I'm saying it helps, but like ^^^^ said. Your helping is so minute there is no benefit to keeping the valves clean. But you definitely are keeping some oil out!


We kinda all do agree haha

 

[jeff]

Oh I'm with you guys. It definitely does SOMETHING


I'm sure I have oil in my pipes, but I dare venture you with OCC also do!


I'm saying it helps, but like ^^^^ said. Your helping is so minute there is no benefit to keeping the valves clean. But you definitely are keeping some oil out!


We kinda all do agree haha

I installed my catch can two years ago, I check periodically, my charge pipes are completely free of oil since install.

 

[DBLE]

For those with quite a few miles on your FiST (i.e. 75k+ miles), is an OCC installed? If not, how are your valves looking? Just curious because I know some members have racked up a lot of miles on their engines.

 

[CarGuy]

I installed my catch can two years ago, I check periodically, my charge pipes are completely free of oil since install.

Just curious as to which one that you use? Brand?

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[dsphil]

The only way to find out how bad it is is to get a borescope or remove the intake manifold. I check it periodically and don't like the looks of it with or without catch can. The amount of oil you see in OCC doesn't mean your intake valve is clean.

 

[jeff]

Oh I'm with you guys. It definitely does SOMETHING


I'm sure I have oil in my pipes, but I dare venture you with OCC also do!


I'm saying it helps, but like ^^^^ said. Your helping is so minute there is no benefit to keeping the valves clean. But you definitely are keeping some oil out!


We kinda all do agree haha

Just curious as to which one that you use? Brand?

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I have a JBR, I did a good bit of study on various brands and the JBR was my favorite. Well made, large capacity, has a valve so I can drain (takes 10 seconds) without removing it like other brands, has baffles, looks cool.

The amount of oil you see in OCC doesn't mean your intake valve is clean.

True true. I agree it may not keep the intake valves totally clean, but it is doing something. But you're right on this.

 

[M-Sport fan]

Also, and I know that the naysayers will claim that it is not even 'splitting micron wide hairs', but every little bit of that EGR blowby shit that is kept out of your combustion chamber will also help increase (or at least not decrease) the octane of the mixture being burned.
WHY I had a Moroso catch can on my NA LS1 Z28.

I don't know about anyone else, but since I do NOT have access to E85 here, and cannot afford Race Gas additive, I will take every single little thousandth of an octane point I can get from my pump gas, whether on the factory tune, or especially on any aftermarket tune, given to me by the catch can.

 

[Intuit]

This is the intake manifold on my naturally aspirated 1.9L SOHC engine at 190k...
https://1drv.ms/i/s!AhsZJDCN8kMMgRgDWyK3LiNYlQtv

That's all PCV and EGR. Since it ran cold, the EGR was completely clogged with ash. EGR is no longer used in many engines today. Up there, the oil & ash didn't experience much heat. Therefore the oil could be easily wiped off the aluminum. Didn't bother anything though but since I had the intake off the (cracked) head anyway I went ahead and sprayed it out with carb-cleaner. Drove the engine another 127k (>327k total) before selling the car over structural rust. Still ran great. This was well before DI technology. The four intake plenum pipes as you can see, are lifted from the floor. The clean throttle plate had a warning engraved on it about not cleaning it, as it had a special non-stick coating that would be damaged by the chemicals. Since EGR was post throttle plate, there was really nothing to get it dirty anyway.

If the 1.6L were known to experience severe build-up and serious running/performance issues as a result of valve build-up, it would be a different matter. But it isn't. Even the mechanic in the U2ube video stated that these weren't known for severe running/performance issues. If you're running 10,500 mile change intervals, stopping and restarting 20 times a day, modified your engine, use crap quality bulk mineral oil, spend the majority of time in creep & stop traffic at 220°F, run without a filter, fill with Uncle Jed's Drive & Go bio-gasoline, drive at equatorial temps, or etc, or etc... probably have some reason to look into it. We have folks at 70 and 80+ (which ain't much) who so far as I've read, haven't complained of running/performance issues.

In theory valve overlap (a.k.a. "scavenging") is responsible for a significant part of the build-up. Here's the face of the valve on that 190k engine. Compare the exhaust valves on cylinders 1/4, to cylinders 2/3. (2/3 were being washed with hot coolant)...
https://1drv.ms/i/s!AhsZJDCN8kMMgR-ix6MgMbXCcRLf

https://1drv.ms/i/s!AhsZJDCN8kMMgTZLWUQ0G1B1Z_aZ

...that little bit of crud, if it were on the top would mean diddly. If you're racing then this will be the lesser of many factors to worry about... such as tuning, tires, suspension and driver training. The engineers design these to run with some crud. If the were that sensitive, a fair percentage of us would already be complaining of performance/running issues.

.

 

[TyphoonFiST]

This is the intake manifold on my naturally aspirated 1.9L SOHC engine at 190k...
https://1drv.ms/i/s!AhsZJDCN8kMMgRgDWyK3LiNYlQtv

That's all PCV and EGR. Since it ran cold, the EGR was completely clogged with ash. EGR is no longer used in many engines today. Up there, the oil & ash didn't experience much heat. Therefore the oil could be easily wiped off the aluminum. Didn't bother anything though but since I had the intake off the (cracked) head anyway I went ahead and sprayed it out with carb-cleaner. Drove the engine another 127k (>327k total) before selling the car over structural rust. Still ran great. This was well before DI technology. The four intake plenum pipes as you can see, are lifted from the floor. The clean throttle plate had a warning engraved on it about not cleaning it, as it had a special non-stick coating that would be damaged by the chemicals. Since EGR was post throttle plate, there was really nothing to get it dirty anyway.

If the 1.6L were known to experience severe build-up and serious running/performance issues as a result of valve build-up, it would be a different matter. But it isn't. Even the mechanic in the U2ube video stated that these weren't known for severe running/performance issues. If you're running 10,500 mile change intervals, stopping and restarting 20 times a day, modified your engine, use crap quality bulk mineral oil, spend the majority of time in creep & stop traffic at 220°F, run without a filter, fill with Uncle Jed's Drive & Go bio-gasoline, drive at equatorial temps, or etc, or etc... probably have some reason to look into it. We have folks at 70 and 80+ (which ain't much) who so far as I've read, haven't complained of running/performance issues.

In theory valve overlap (a.k.a. "scavenging") is responsible for a significant part of the build-up. Here's the face of the valve on that 190k engine. Compare the exhaust valves on cylinders 1/4, to cylinders 2/3. (2/3 were being washed with hot coolant)...
https://1drv.ms/i/s!AhsZJDCN8kMMgR-ix6MgMbXCcRLf

https://1drv.ms/i/s!AhsZJDCN8kMMgTZLWUQ0G1B1Z_aZ

...that little bit of crud, if it were on the top would mean diddly. If you're racing then this will be the lesser of many factors to worry about... such as tuning, tires, suspension and driver training.

Bravo! I like your style....well most of the time anyways. Kudos!

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[OrangeFiST]

My service advisor just got back to me. He said just use a good grade gasoline. He also said Ford does not recommend fuel additives but he does use Techron once in a while.

 

[weazsel]

Like I said I would do. This is from 1,000 miles to 2,800 miles.

 

[TyphoonFiST]

My service advisor just got back to me. He said just use a good grade gasoline. He also said Ford does not recommend fuel additives but he does use Techron once in a while.

Well if your MeeLee....you're gonna roll 87 octane and mix oils so....he will have a dilemma there.

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[Quisp]

I installed my catch can two years ago, I check periodically, my charge pipes are completely free of oil since install.

I noticed the same. Before CC oil in charge pipes after none.

 

[TyphoonFiST]

The oil is what erodes the factory charge hoses and makes the super pliable due to the oil contamination also. What happens when the engine is under boost its like a vacuum and sucks them down in size.

 

[jeff]

The oil is what erodes the factory charge hoses and makes the super pliable due to the oil contamination also. What happens when the engine is under boost its like a vacuum and sucks them down in size.

Very good point my man..........but where's the visual aid???!!!!!!

But seriously, back on stock stage 3 power around 215hp my charge pipes blew off.....I added a catch can and a turbo swap and one extra $4 Autozone clamp to the charge pipes....now at 298hp they have never blown off. I think the catch can preventing that oil lubrication has also helped keep my charge pipes on. One more reason why catch cans are NOT a waste of time and money!!!!!

 

[scooter123]

According to my dealer the Mustang is getting supplemental port fuel injection in 2019 and all the other DI engines will get the supplemental system in 2020. So Ford is aware of the issue and doing something about it. As for us, I'm looking into a throttle body Aux Fuel system and getting a tune to compensate for the fuel adder. I'll also probably add a dual catch can system because my dealer advises installing one and they state that it will NOT effect my warranty because they consider catch cans as Preventative devices.
Have not talked to the dealer about an Aux Fuel system but when I get time plan on doing that. I suspect that Aux Fuel won't be warranty friendly because it's probably NOT emissions legal because it wasn't a Ford original install.

 

[jmrtsus]

Thanks all. I really appreciate it

The so called built in OCC is not very effective. My Damond catches about an ounce per oil change (4k). That is oil the "built in OCC" did not catch and would have reached the back of the valves and will not cause deposits. The folks trying to sell Aux fuel injection will try to convince you OCC's are not needed due to the internal OCC. If that was the case why would you need to buy their Aux fuel injection? BTW the same idiots will tell you all an OCC catches mostly WATER, false. Get an OCC, the oil it catches proves it works! I love my Damond, plug and play...no cutting factory hoses, easy to drain and install. Do NOT get a generic OCC that requires cutting factory hoses. You will "hose" yourself if service is ever required.