Dizzy Tuning Intake Tests

[bombo107]

Copied from Dizzy Tunings facebook page figured you guys would want to check it out if you haven't already.

INTAKE TESTING – DYNO RESULTS!!!

Vehicle/Mods:
2016 Fiesta ST (w/ ‘15 evap lines)
Depo FMIC
Cobb hotpipe/CPE coldpipe
GFB DV+
Velossatech snorkel
Damond OCC with VTA option
NGK 6510 step colder spark plugs

Tune:
Dizzy Tuning E30 Fiesta Flash Tune V1

The long awaited dyno results are here for the various intakes that I tested. Sorry for the delay on this, I have had a lot going on lately, but I did not want to hold up the generous people that lent me their intakes any longer. I want to state up front, that I was not able to do nearly all the testing that I wanted to. I wanted to do more specific testing on the RAMAIR crossover pipe, but was not able to get more than one batch of runs on the crossover. There are just way too many intake variations and options, that I would have been at the shop for 12 hours straight.

So what I did was follow the typical mod path of a Fiesta ST owner, to see what gains can be gained with the variations of modifications available. So here are the first batch of test setups that were performed, and the best run of the three done on each setup is shown in parenthesis:

Dyno Runs 041-043: 100% OEM intake
(300.2tq/229.1hp)

Dyno runs 044-046: added Mishimoto induction hose
(311.9tq/229.2hp)
A gain of 11.7tq and .1hp

Dyno runs 047, 053 and 054: added Cobb panel filter
(314.1tq/229.8hp)
A gain of 13.9 tq and .7hp over OEM

Dyno runs 066-068: added RAMAIR crossover pipe
(320.2tq/233.2hp)
A gain of 20tq and 4.1hp over OEM


Looking at the above data, you can see there are proven gains from each intake modification added. The induction hose is good for about 10ft/lbs of torque, but VERY little hp. The crossover pipe added both torque and about 4-5hp, as it is most likely flowing better in the higher RPM’s. The question is, are these gains worth the amount of money spent on the modification? I feel very strongly that the statement “gains are so minimal, it’s not worth it”, somehow transformed into the statement “intakes do not do anything for the Fiesta”, and it has stuck ever since.

After these tests were done, I then performed some tests on other aftermarket intake systems available on the market. Below is the results of these tests and again, the best run of the three done on each setup is shown in parenthesis:

Dyno runs 057-059: all parts removed and Cobb intake installed
(319.8tq/231.0hp)
A gain of 19.6 tq and 1.9hp over OEM

Dyno runs 060-062: all parts removed and 2JR cowl intake installed
(319.9tq/233.9hp)
A gain of 19.7 and 4.8hp over OEM

Dyno runs 063-065: all parts removed and AEM intake installed (with OEM crossover)
(318.5tq/234.8hp)
A gain of 18.3tq and 5.7hp


I was honestly very surprised by the AEM intake. It appears to flow better than the 2JR, which eliminates the crossover. Either that, or the 2JR was not justified by dyno testing, as it was not getting the underhood/cowl pressure that it would have on the highway.

All in all, I’m pretty happy with the test results, and I think I plan to run a crossover and an intake with a cone filter (like AEM or MAP) in the future. I know that gains are minimal, but they are there and we have the data to prove it!

 

[MYenvyST14]

Slow clap for this thread! Awesome information

 

[Hijinx]

The question is, are these gains worth the amount of money spent on the modification? I feel very strongly that the statement “gains are so minimal, it’s not worth it”, somehow transformed into the statement “intakes do not do anything for the Fiesta”, and it has stuck ever since.

As I alluded to on FB, this is a very important distinction to make. I want to expand a little bit on this idea and hopefully I don’t subtract from the data.

The consumer must determine, based on the data, whether the gains from an intake is worth its price. Many decide they want an intake anyway, and that is great. But, if you’re solely basing a decision on data, the data needs to be scrutinized because the gains really are very minimal. In light of the minimal gains, you could spend that money elsewhere and be happier, overall. I understand that some people just like putting their hands to work and modding, so again, that’s perfectly fine.

I just believe that it is extremely important to understand WHY you’re modding. This information is great because it gives consumers a chance to understand that they aren’t getting a whole lot of bang for their buck, should they choose to make an intake purchase. So that “WHY” becomes more definite as in “because I want to” or “because it does X” instead of “because the Fiesta might need it” or “because it should do X.” We can now make positive statements about intakes instead of relying on normative statements, which is a great thing.



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[FromChaos79]

Rad that you took your own time to do this and get information for everyone to drool over, well done! Glad you did intake results as well to show the difference. I can assume with my K&N full intake that I would yield similar results. Cant wait to grab my Dizzy Tune here in the next few weeks.

 

[MitchsFiesta]

While I love good testing, every test needs analysis. Dyno numbers are important, but a small piece of the picture.

All in all, you have to go back to what difference an intake makes. Your overall goal is to have the least pressure drop by the time it hits the compressor blades. There is actually tables in the ECU to account for this (assuming the air comes in at atmospheric pressure, it accounts for the loss across the filter as well as the loss from the filter to the turbo.)

What I am getting at, is, what changed across the runs in order to develop more power and torque? WGDC is a big one I would look at. If the pressure before the turbo is higher, it should need less WGDC to generate the same TIP (throttle inlet pressure). One of the intakes that showed less power might actually be the best as it would have made more TIP with the same WGDC, which creates throttle closures, which lowers hp/torque.

Don't get me wrong, I think this is awesome, and many props to Jason for putting in the work!

 

[A7xogg]

While I love good testing, every test needs analysis. Dyno numbers are important, but a small piece of the picture.

All in all, you have to go back to what difference an intake makes. Your overall goal is to have the least pressure drop by the time it hits the compressor blades. There is actually tables in the ECU to account for this (assuming the air comes in at atmospheric pressure, it accounts for the loss across the filter as well as the loss from the filter to the turbo.)

What I am getting at, is, what changed across the runs in order to develop more power and torque? WGDC is a big one I would look at. If the pressure before the turbo is higher, it should need less WGDC to generate the same TIP (throttle inlet pressure). One of the intakes that showed less power might actually be the best as it would have made more TIP with the same WGDC, which creates throttle closures, which lowers hp/torque.

Don't get me wrong, I think this is awesome, and many props to Jason for putting in the work!

Which a intake that flows more would have less pressure drop.

 

[danbfree]

No exhaust mods are mentioned, with all other B.O's I wonder if he forgot to mention which exhaust or was it all stock? All interested in seeing the gains of an intake with only said intake and a "regular" 91 or 93 tune... but for the guys running everything they can it looks like the 2JR and AEM are the way to go hands down!

 

[Jason@dizzytuning]

No exhaust mods are mentioned, with all other B.O's I wonder if he forgot to mention which exhaust or was it all stock? All interested in seeing the gains of an intake with only said intake and a "regular" 91 or 93 tune... but for the guys running everything they can it looks like the 2JR and AEM are the way to go hands down!

Completely stock exhaust.

 

[danbfree]

Completely stock exhaust.

Thanks for clarifying Jason, now can't help but wonder how much a modded exhaust would help now! LOL

 

[M-Sport fan]

Thanks for clarifying Jason, now can't help but wonder how much a modded exhaust would help now! LOL

According to most on here (including most of the tuners, even the ones selling their OWN branded exhaust systems), VERY LITTLE, yes, even with a full 3", NOT 'necked down' catcon-less down pipe.

I chose to go with the CP-E Nexus cat back for the reasons stated above by Issac (Hijinx), since I could not even hear this car running with the stock system (and I did not want to totally hack up/weld onto said system, like so many do, just in case I ever had to put it back on TO FACTORY specs), as well as for having a FULL 304 stainless unit on the car).

I did not even care IF I actually lost a couple of ponies/pound feet somewhere in the rev range over the factory system, it was just WAY TOO DAMNED QUIET for me to even launch the car properly.

 

[danbfree]

According to most on here (including most of the tuners, even the ones selling their OWN branded exhaust systems), VERY LITTLE, yes, even with a full 3", NOT 'necked down' catcon-less down pipe.

I chose to go with the CP-E Nexus cat back for the reasons stated above by Issac (Hijinx), since I could not even hear this car running with the stock system (and I did not want to totally hack up/weld onto said system, like so many do, just in case I ever had to put it back on TO FACTORY specs), as well as for having a FULL 304 stainless unit on the car).

I did not even care IF I actually lost a couple of ponies/pound feet somewhere in the rev range over the factory system, it was just WAY TOO DAMNED QUIET for me to even launch the car properly.

Well, we all know in general the exhaust didn't add much but that was assuming stock or few other mods, but I figured with all other mods and tuned that it could be a factor, why not run something just in case it changes what the intake adds? When they compare computer video cards, they make sure to use the fastest CPU possible to ensure no bottlenecks and see how they differ... but ultimately apparently it's the tiny stock turbo that's still the bottleneck? but if an intake can make a little power, that's more air being moved and it has to go somewhere., I figure the stock exhaust could be a bottleneck at that point.

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[Hellboy's_Fist]

I knew exactly what I was getting into with my intake. It's a full Injen intake and I got it for a great price on sale.

I knew at worst it would be the same performance as the stock one until I swapped the turbo. That's fine I had
plans for a bigger turbo. What I paid for is the fact I can now hear all of the noises that make turbo cars interesting
and the car looks sexier when the hood is up. A nice bonus is a cleanable filter.

 

[danbfree]

I knew exactly what I was getting into with my intake. It's a full Injen intake and I got it for a great price on sale.

I knew at worst it would be the same performance as the stock one until I swapped the turbo. That's fine I had
plans for a bigger turbo. What I paid for is the fact I can now hear all of the noises that make turbo cars interesting
and the car looks sexier when the hood is up. A nice bonus is a cleanable filter.

A drop in alone did that for me... stock BOV, wastegate and that scraping sound of the air going through the IC, all more pronounced with just a drop in...

 

[HBEcoBeaST]

A drop in alone did that for me... stock BOV, wastegate and that scraping sound of the air going through the IC, all more pronounced with just a drop in...

An open air element is much more pronounced sounding. It sounds similar to having a bov except half the volume. Under acceleration you can hear it with the windows up, not so much with a drop in.

I too run a drop in and while it does add noise (and performance?) I'm looking into open air elements. Rather have a louder, legal intake than loud exhaust.

The noise alone is worth it for most.

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[A7xogg]

An open air element is much more pronounced sounding. It sounds similar to having a bov except half the volume. Under acceleration you can hear it with the windows up, not so much with a drop in.

I too run a drop in and while it does add noise (and performance?) I'm looking into open air elements. Rather have a louder, legal intake than loud exhaust.

The noise alone is worth it for most.

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Open air intake ftw always

 

[ron@whoosh]

would love to know the results of the ITG aside of these other intakes

 

[stascom]

Interesting. Good to see that the stock box is not a limitation.

 

[XanRules]

I've just about got my intake assembled. Would anyone be interested in some data logs showing the difference between a heat-wrapped crossover pipe and a non-heat-wrapped crossover? My thinking is that since the crossover is right near the turbo, and charge air temps are such a tough thing to keep in check in this car, proper heat wrapping of the intake - especially a metal crossover pipe - would be a significant benefit.

If so, what data would y'all like to see, other than the obvious Charge Air Temps?

 

[stascom]

I've just about got my intake assembled. Would anyone be interested in some data logs showing the difference between a heat-wrapped crossover pipe and a non-heat-wrapped crossover? My thinking is that since the crossover is right near the turbo, and charge air temps are such a tough thing to keep in check in this car, proper heat wrapping of the intake - especially a metal crossover pipe - would be a significant benefit.

If so, what data would y'all like to see, other than the obvious Charge Air Temps?

Sounds interesting. You'd have to be very careful to make sure the data is relevant. A warm up run before several logged passes would be important, IMO.

 

[XanRules]

Cool yeah, I've never actually uhhhh datalogged for these purposes so I may need some help in how I construct the tests.