Would the Fiesta ST see a second generation?

[bigshotdan]

As geoffyb said, they are talking about in the US. We haven't had all these awesome cares you overseas folk get

On the contrary, there's a lot we don't get; we've only had two generations of Fiesta here in Oz, haven't had an Escort since the very early 80s, never got the Sierra... the list goes on. And that's the fast Ford stock.

It seems to me, given how many people populate the various forums in the States, that there is a market for these cars. I can see it continuing. Then again, I'd never want to second-guess Ford...

 

[Original J-Pat]

Sorry, but this is crap. I'm under 30, and like most people my age and younger, what keeps us out of performance cars isn't that we're not interested in driving, or performance. It's that we're broke. Crushing college loans, staggering youth unemployment that is much, much higher than the national average, That means that most of us can't afford model-year new cars, much less a performance spec car. The result is most of us youngins' who are into performance buy cheap, ratted-out 90s Japanese idols like the S-chassis, Zed, and the like. Why? They're dirt cheap, and really, often far more thrilling than most anything under $40k new. The truth is... us under 30s? We don't care about the Mustang, the Challenger, Camaro, etc. Yeah. There are some Millennials (I hate that term...so much) who like muscle. Hell, I kind of like vintage muscle. But that is a much smaller segment compared to those of us who grew up idolizing cars that were winning the horsepower (and handling, don't forget handling) wars of the late 80s through the 90s and early 2000s. Those cars? They were from Japan. Now, a bunch of them are available for cheap. Maybe not mint--you won't find a fourth generation Toyota Supra RZ in the bargain bin, and you won't ever again unless it's a salvage--but you'll find an FC3S RX7, middle generation MR2 turbo, plenty of 240SXes and scads upon scads of non-turbo 300ZX begging for a strip-job or engine swap. If you're adventurous, you may even buy a EG or EK generation Civic hatchback and begin the laborious process of buying CTR parts and crying in your garage about how difficult they are to retrofit.

With the era of cheap gas over, and a sudden (but not particularly effective) panic over being kind to the environment (not to mention heavy safety features), most cars available to us new are slow, boring, and designed mainly for cheap commuting. You want a balls-out fun ride that'll hang its tail out? That'll be a minimum of 26 grand. For some, living at home, with few bills and parents that can cosign for that 0% loan, that's easy. You see those kids in STis and Genesis R-Specs, and even Mustang GT Track Pack cars sometimes. You see them in 370Z Sport or NISMO editions. But most of us? We're working on that beat-up E46 or S13. Hell, I considered restoring an '88 Scirocco 16V (I could have bought it for $900 when it was actually about $2500 of non-running spare parts)... Let that sink in for a moment.

We're interested in high-performance, just like you. The difference is, the people before us crashed the economy, and we're paying the price. When we're 45 and have the better-paying jobs (probably only after the boomers have sloughed it off into retirement homes and gated communities in Boca), we'll be the ones driving the Cayman Ses, 911s, AMG mercs, top trim Shelbys, 'vettes, or even something as simple as a Golf R--which when spec'd with anything, becomes a $40,000 proposition. We're putting off, for the most part, having the new performance vehicle. Why? Most of us are more concerned with putting food in our bellies, paying off that (apparently useless) education our balding guidance counselors told us would get us the jobs, and making rent.

I hope the FiST gets a few good years of production. I love mine, and it's the reason I'm able to afford a new, under-warranty performance vehicle today instead of driving a Scirocco 16V I have 4 different (probably busted) hatches for, or a matte black vinyl-wrap mistake of a 240SX I bought off of some guy with an 'illest' tee-shirt.

Can you write my essays? Lol jk this is the exact reason I bought a FiST i was looking at alot of other used cars and if I ever found anything good it was like a 5k more thank kbb. I'm 20 and have a part time job go to school and play football and I can afford this and its perfect for me

 

[airjor13]

Sorry, but this is crap. I'm under 30, and like most people my age and younger, what keeps us out of performance cars isn't that we're not interested in driving, or performance. It's that we're broke. Crushing college loans, staggering youth unemployment that is much, much higher than the national average, That means that most of us can't afford model-year new cars, much less a performance spec car. The result is most of us youngins' who are into performance buy cheap, ratted-out 90s Japanese idols like the S-chassis, Zed, and the like. Why? They're dirt cheap, and really, often far more thrilling than most anything under $40k new. The truth is... us under 30s? We don't care about the Mustang, the Challenger, Camaro, etc. Yeah. There are some Millennials (I hate that term...so much) who like muscle. Hell, I kind of like vintage muscle. But that is a much smaller segment compared to those of us who grew up idolizing cars that were winning the horsepower (and handling, don't forget handling) wars of the late 80s through the 90s and early 2000s. Those cars? They were from Japan. Now, a bunch of them are available for cheap. Maybe not mint--you won't find a fourth generation Toyota Supra RZ in the bargain bin, and you won't ever again unless it's a salvage--but you'll find an FC3S RX7, middle generation MR2 turbo, plenty of 240SXes and scads upon scads of non-turbo 300ZX begging for a strip-job or engine swap. If you're adventurous, you may even buy a EG or EK generation Civic hatchback and begin the laborious process of buying CTR parts and crying in your garage about how difficult they are to retrofit.

With the era of cheap gas over, and a sudden (but not particularly effective) panic over being kind to the environment (not to mention heavy safety features), most cars available to us new are slow, boring, and designed mainly for cheap commuting. You want a balls-out fun ride that'll hang its tail out? That'll be a minimum of 26 grand. For some, living at home, with few bills and parents that can cosign for that 0% loan, that's easy. You see those kids in STis and Genesis R-Specs, and even Mustang GT Track Pack cars sometimes. You see them in 370Z Sport or NISMO editions. But most of us? We're working on that beat-up E46 or S13. Hell, I considered restoring an '88 Scirocco 16V (I could have bought it for $900 when it was actually about $2500 of non-running spare parts)... Let that sink in for a moment.

We're interested in high-performance, just like you. The difference is, the people before us crashed the economy, and we're paying the price. When we're 45 and have the better-paying jobs (probably only after the boomers have sloughed it off into retirement homes and gated communities in Boca), we'll be the ones driving the Cayman Ses, 911s, AMG mercs, top trim Shelbys, 'vettes, or even something as simple as a Golf R--which when spec'd with anything, becomes a $40,000 proposition. We're putting off, for the most part, having the new performance vehicle. Why? Most of us are more concerned with putting food in our bellies, paying off that (apparently useless) education our balding guidance counselors told us would get us the jobs, and making rent.

I hope the FiST gets a few good years of production. I love mine, and it's the reason I'm able to afford a new, under-warranty performance vehicle today instead of driving a Scirocco 16V I have 4 different (probably busted) hatches for, or a matte black vinyl-wrap mistake of a 240SX I bought off of some guy with an 'illest' tee-shirt.

Deep, sad but true

 

[AnArmyOfJuan]

Kind of like the old Dodge Shelby Omni GLHS's or Pontiac Skyhawk GT turbo....

Many moons ago, I had a 1987 Pontiac Sunbird Turbo GT. It was my second car (after an '85 Buick Skyhawk SCS 5-speed), in 1995. That car was an absolute blast, even with the automatic transmission. It looked pretty cool too, with its two-tone black and red paint job. Unfortunately the non-intercooled turbo forced me to replace the entire cooling system piece by piece by piece over the course of a summer, until it finally overheated one too many times and cracked the head. I raced a VW Corrado on 696 in Detroit and got it up to 135 (in traffic!). It was the last truly fun car I owned until I got my FiST.

 

[Rocket]

I drive that car new my buddy's older brother bought one , that was a cool car when it was new , I still remember that feeling of driving that car when he brought it home from the dealer , stick nice , actually reminds me of the st .

 

[BeansNCornbread]

Deep, sad but true

Just like Europe, which created this hot hatch right? Economics being the relation of course, not the specifics.

 

[scotman]

I think the big difference between European fiesta owners and those in the U.S. is one of the FIST being the single car purchased in Europe and the U.S buyer owns theirs in addition to one or more vehicles. The fact I own an old, late sixties gas guzzling Mustang ( that I have no intention of selling soon!) leads me to seek rational choices for the other vehicles. But, rational does not mean dull or boring. Anyone that wants a fiesta st should probably Get their asses to a dealer and order one. They are not an expensive car. No excuses can be made. Coulda, woulda, shoulda and boo hoo don't carry any weight for something as dumb simple as sign and drive! As for everyone who hopes they don't sell in volume.you got your wish! If you think that translates to a great resale value in five or ten years, Nope! They won't return enough to call them an investment.

 

[Chuckable]

Sorry, but this is crap. I'm under 30, and like most people my age and younger, what keeps us out of performance cars isn't that we're not interested in driving, or performance. It's that we're broke. Crushing college loans, staggering youth unemployment that is much, much higher than the national average, That means that most of us can't afford model-year new cars, much less a performance spec car. The result is most of us youngins' who are into performance buy cheap, ratted-out 90s Japanese idols like the S-chassis, Zed, and the like. Why? They're dirt cheap, and really, often far more thrilling than most anything under $40k new. The truth is... us under 30s? We don't care about the Mustang, the Challenger, Camaro, etc. Yeah. There are some Millennials (I hate that term...so much) who like muscle. Hell, I kind of like vintage muscle. But that is a much smaller segment compared to those of us who grew up idolizing cars that were winning the horsepower (and handling, don't forget handling) wars of the late 80s through the 90s and early 2000s. Those cars? They were from Japan. Now, a bunch of them are available for cheap. Maybe not mint--you won't find a fourth generation Toyota Supra RZ in the bargain bin, and you won't ever again unless it's a salvage--but you'll find an FC3S RX7, middle generation MR2 turbo, plenty of 240SXes and scads upon scads of non-turbo 300ZX begging for a strip-job or engine swap. If you're adventurous, you may even buy a EG or EK generation Civic hatchback and begin the laborious process of buying CTR parts and crying in your garage about how difficult they are to retrofit.

With the era of cheap gas over, and a sudden (but not particularly effective) panic over being kind to the environment (not to mention heavy safety features), most cars available to us new are slow, boring, and designed mainly for cheap commuting. You want a balls-out fun ride that'll hang its tail out? That'll be a minimum of 26 grand. For some, living at home, with few bills and parents that can cosign for that 0% loan, that's easy. You see those kids in STis and Genesis R-Specs, and even Mustang GT Track Pack cars sometimes. You see them in 370Z Sport or NISMO editions. But most of us? We're working on that beat-up E46 or S13. Hell, I considered restoring an '88 Scirocco 16V (I could have bought it for $900 when it was actually about $2500 of non-running spare parts)... Let that sink in for a moment.

We're interested in high-performance, just like you. The difference is, the people before us crashed the economy, and we're paying the price. When we're 45 and have the better-paying jobs (probably only after the boomers have sloughed it off into retirement homes and gated communities in Boca), we'll be the ones driving the Cayman Ses, 911s, AMG mercs, top trim Shelbys, 'vettes, or even something as simple as a Golf R--which when spec'd with anything, becomes a $40,000 proposition. We're putting off, for the most part, having the new performance vehicle. Why? Most of us are more concerned with putting food in our bellies, paying off that (apparently useless) education our balding guidance counselors told us would get us the jobs, and making rent.

I hope the FiST gets a few good years of production. I love mine, and it's the reason I'm able to afford a new, under-warranty performance vehicle today instead of driving a Scirocco 16V I have 4 different (probably busted) hatches for, or a matte black vinyl-wrap mistake of a 240SX I bought off of some guy with an 'illest' tee-shirt.

Tip of the hat to you, sir, for a well-written and thoughtful perspective Or since you're a millenial (I dislike that expression too), nice job, bro!

 

[BeansNCornbread]

I think the big difference between European fiesta owners and those in the U.S. is one of the FIST being the single car purchased in Europe and the U.S buyer owns theirs in addition to one or more vehicles. The fact I own an old, late sixties gas guzzling Mustang ( that I have no intention of selling soon!) leads me to seek rational choices for the other vehicles. But, rational does not mean dull or boring. Anyone that wants a fiesta st should probably Get their asses to a dealer and order one. They are not an expensive car. No excuses can be made. Coulda, woulda, shoulda and boo hoo don't carry any weight for something as dumb simple as sign and drive! As for everyone who hopes they don't sell in volume.you got your wish! If you think that translates to a great resale value in five or ten years, Nope! They won't return enough to call them an investment.

That is not the reality I've over the last 22 years when I've visited family or been their for work. Could be the case though.

 

[GAbOS]

I think the US is finally making the swing to smaller cars but slowly and with much greater cost. But isn't that the response to everything with the US versus Europe? Can we haz your internets yet please?!

I was stupid impressed to see all of the YoueTube and Streaming hots shoes falling over themselves claiming the Fiesta was the better buy over the Focus. This was finally the opening I needed. I was already looking into something smaller with some rear room. The focus was my original choice on storage space alone. It just kills the market in any trim. The Golf was not an option due to it's ridiculous price and handful of known issues both with the current drive train and the last (few). The Veloster Turbo, specifically the R-Spec was very high on my list and a direct competitor to the Fiesta. In my "new car" searches, I wanted zero options aside from Recaro's. I mean, no options. I just fell into my loaded Fiesta by stupid chance. The pull for the R-Spec Veloster is also it's valid gimic. More for less! Crank windows, manual everything and not even push start, keyless entry or a myriad of other cheap, 1st world gimics of the standard turbo.. FOR LESS. we are talking 20k folks, with tuned suspension and sport interior.

How I got to the Fiesta was via trading in my 2010 Mitsubishi Ralliart that only had 60k on the odo. I still feel a wave of regret every time I think of seeing this car for the last time still. It was a truly spectacular car. During my ownership of the Lancer, I got the BMW e30 bug. I found my car and over paid for it. I continued to overpay it into a monster of a car that still needs work.

The End.

Notes that take it off topic:

That bad ass Lancer that would still be here if it were manual was only 26k in 2010!!!!1111oneoneone
Prices are stupid and don't even get me started on the price trucks and why we lost the Ranger(small truck market) but Eruo didn't.
If I didnt have the e30 bug, I would have traded the Ralliart for a 2015 Evo Manual.

 

[scotman]

That is not the reality I've over the last 22 years when I've visited family or been their for work. Could be the case though.

I dug into the data. The U.S. average of miles driven is slowly rising, along with average commute mileages. But the Europeans are catching up. The cost of driving is much higher per mile in Europe, with insurance being almost unavailable in some regions without a dashcam. The speed limits are higher but the fines for messing up are huge. European cities are much more anti car than most U.S. cities. NY city is probably the most unfriendly city to private car ownership.Paris and London are very difficult places to own a car,cost wise. I love cars. I had to spend two and a half months in new York city in 2006 for work. I left swearing never to return. It was a suffocating existence for me. Not at all exciting. Waiting for cabs. Standing in the fart scented air of the subways. Stepping over the bums on stairs laying in their own piss and puke. People in miid continent America should appreciate how good they have it! I could not find much comparison of vehicle numbers owned between us and euro, but my experience has led me to believe that many more European enthusiasts would own more than one car if they had a place to park them!

 

[scotman]

I drove a 04 Lancer ralliart O.Z. edition automatic that my company leased. Badass is not the impression that car left on me. Well, not the ass part of it anyway.

 

[GAbOS]

I drove a 04 Lancer ralliart O.Z. edition automatic that my company leased. Badass is not the impression that car left on me. Well, not the ass part of it anyway.

Hah! They made good FWD rally cars, but the last gen Ralliart was an Evo minus the wide body. Much easier to live with.

 

[scotman]

I spent a lot of time in both Lancers and Evolutions thru 07. I could not draw many comparisons between them. The level of changes was very, very profound. It is very unfortunate that things have gone so badly for mma. But egos and distant management by a larger company with many other interests and challenges makes for poor decisions and bad results.

 

[Siestarider]

Does anyone have #'s on FiST's produced/sold since 2013? US and/or World?

I tried to find some and could not. Ford secret?

 

[scotman]

I have seen production figures, but they do not break out ST totals.....

Does anyone have #'s on FiST's produced/sold since 2013? US and/or World?

I tried to find some and could not. Ford secret?

I would guess the totals are not more than five to seven thousand a year. It might just turn out that the ST version will probably just cut into the take rate/ demand for the manual transmission equipped 1.6 liter "basic" Fiesta! I think the hardcore MPG seekers are drawn to the 1.0 EB. That leaves the M/T "basic" Fiesta to be the automotive equivalent of the nice girl who can't get a date to the prom!

 

[jayrod1980]

Seriously... with One World Ford and the popularity of the Fiesta in Europe, if they get another ST, so will we. It doesn't really cost them much to have it available for sale here. It would be a different situation if the US and Euro crash test laws weren't as close as they are today, and with Ford committed to selling more or less the same cars in all markets where possible. I think they've learned their lesson from enthusiast rage regarding keeping all of their cool cars overseas. Hell, the fact that the Focus RS is coming to the United States should be proof that they will bring a new Fiesta ST here if Europe gets one.

 

[scotman]

Actually, it DOES cost seriously!

Seriously... with One World Ford and the popularity of the Fiesta in Europe, if they get another ST, so will we. It doesn't really cost them much to have it available for sale here. It would be a different situation if the US and Euro crash test laws weren't as close as they are today, and with Ford committed to selling more or less the same cars in all markets where possible. I think they've learned their lesson from enthusiast rage regarding keeping all of their cool cars overseas. Hell, the fact that the Focus RS is coming to the United States should be proof that they will bring a new Fiesta ST here if Europe gets one.

To cert a vehicle for North America is not a cheap proposition. If we dont get a next generation Fiesta, I do not see the business case for an ST version only. The explanation is in the overall sales numbers. I wont burst your bubble if you want to think that there will be a "next one". It's funny you mention that Ford is "keeping all their cool cars overseas" because that was a complaint i heard from British Ford enthusiasts regarding the Mustang GT and ford GT!! So, Nobody is happy then. A V8 Mustang is very highly prized in the U.K. They will always complain at first that its a gas hog and handles badly. Then they ask you if you would consider selling yours to them and shipping it over! They effin loooooooooooove em.

 

[BronxBomber]

I spent a lot of time in both Lancers and Evolutions thru 07. I could not draw many comparisons between them. The level of changes was very, very profound. It is very unfortunate that things have gone so badly for mma. But egos and distant management by a larger company with many other interests and challenges makes for poor decisions and bad results.

Just an FYI. In 08 the Evo was now in its 10th iteration, hence the X. When this generation Lancer Ralliart came out it was very closely associated with the Evo X. Just an FYI. In 08 the Evo was now in its 10th iteration, hence the X. When this generation Lancer Ralliart came out it was very closely associated with the Evo X. It was basically a FWD Evo minus wide body and Awd system. Very different animal compared to the previous gen Lancer Ralliart, which was just an appearance package till 2006 when it moved from a NA 2.0 to an NA 2.4 with respectable acceleration.

 

[Sil3nt611]

I live in Texas where you're not a man if you don't drive a truck... At least that's what one of my co-workers says. I could care less if he or anyone else doesn't view me as a "manly" man for driving a small car though. He is however very hypocritical when he sees a lifted truck saying the owner is compensating for something (take a guess). The other big argument by both my boss and said co-worker is large vehicles protect better in an accident. This is why they both daily drive big F-250s... I've seen pictures and heard stories of people surviving pretty bad crashes in small cars. Many of those small cars over a decade old in safety features. I've also seen people die in bad accidents with larger vehicles. And yes, people do get very injured or die in small car accidents and live in big vehicles accidents. The point is when it's your time to go you will go and your car will not be your savior. I've avoided many accidents in the time that I have driven a small car that I very well may not have been able to avoid driving a larger vehicle. They don't stop as fast or maneuver as well. So while you survived in your large vehicle accident, I maneuvered my way out of even having that accident in my small car. I had the better day I would say.

Americans don't have much respect for hot hatches. Most performance oriented Americans like American "Straight-Line" Muscle. I was interviewing for a company a little over a year ago and had put down a few of my personal interests on my resume so my interviewer commented on the fact that I put down 'cars' as one of my interests. He asked me what my dream car was; and to be honest the Fiesta ST was my attainable dream car, so that's what I said. I don't remember what he said exactly, but it seemed like disgust and "you're not really a car guy" type of thing because he was a classic American Muscle guy.

As for the comment on younger people not interested in performance cars, that's definitely not the case. They may be content with driving something slower to get them from a to b since it was cheaper, but they would likely prefer to be driving something more exciting. A lot of younger people are getting married and having kids pretty young, so they need something a bit larger and more practical, which also equates to less fun. High school and college age kids don't have the money for a new car unless mommy and daddy buy it for them so they're in the used market. I am in the after college market, where some can't find good jobs so they're stuck with what they got. Those of us that do get good jobs still have student debt so going right into a new car out of school is not a good financial move. I personally have been saving up for my $10k down payment for over the last year and feel fairly comfortable with going into a new car, especially with my old car starting to show it's 13 year old age. I have been driving a modified 2003 Ford ZX2 for the past 7 years during hs and college and having a lot of fun with it. I've been ready to move on for awhile but financially was unable to until now. I'm picking up my 2016 Fiesta ST tomorrow!