Oil catch can/Separator

[XuperXero]

That is good to hear.
My other thought is that the P in PCV stands for Positive.
That is Positive Crankcase Ventilation.

Not only is VTA not smog legal but how is it as efficient in removing dangerous gasoline vapors out of the oil pan.

I don't know if any of you have ever seen an oil pan blow up?
I have.



Dave

That's understandable, but my understanding is that the Positive pressure in the valve cover is what causes the PCV to open in the first place so venting to atmosphere should not affect it. There's also no proof that the port from intake manifold would use vacuum to draw open the PCV.

 

[MOFiST]

That is good to hear.
My other thought is that the P in PCV stands for Positive.
That is Positive Crankcase Ventilation.

Not only is VTA not smog legal but how is it as efficient in removing dangerous gasoline vapors out of the oil pan.

I don't know if any of you have ever seen an oil pan blow up?
I have.



Dave

Good point Dave. That's a sounds like a nightmare. I wonder if it'd have a detrimental effect on your oil as well with less fuel vapor escaping.

 

[D1JL]

As for the picture in post #177.
That really does nothing.
Now you are not sucking air through/across the valve cover but just venting through that bypass filter.
Where is the vacuum that makes the catch can work?

Having the inlet air tube connected to its normal location on the main intake pipe it is connected out through the air filter so that fresh air can be drawn in to purge the vapors from the valve cover and crankcase.



Dave

 

[D1JL]

Good point Dave. That's a sounds like a nightmare. I wonder if it'd have a detrimental effect on your oil as well with less fuel vapor escaping.

Yes,
Most people do idle the car just before turning it off.
During that time most of the gas vapor is sucked out.
By not sucking the gas vapor out it can settle on top of the oil and then mix, thereby thinning the oil.

In this case if it sucks it's a good thing.




Dave

 

[rodmoe]

You bring up a good point Dave I had never thought of with a gasoline motor though I have been working around Hydrogen filled Generators for near 37 year and we must maintain a Vacuum on our Oil seal systems used to keep the Hydrogen in the Gen. and that is to keep the hydrogen that gets entrained in the oil from becoming explosive. If either Vac pump fails we have 24 hrs to fix it or we shut down the Turbine/Gen till it is fixed..
I know cool story bro and all that but Dave speak to a good point..
just sayin also I heard Boomba may be making OCC just to ad that in the mix again..
I do however think if you wanted one OCC the pic on post 177 if you take the filter off and run it to the air intake in front of the turbo it would wark and keep most stuff off the valve stems but it would impinge on the turbo blading and could cause erosion over time. Like I have said in the cold north here I was getting more water than oil in me OCC over winter so had to check it everyday to get a feel for it..

 

[D1JL]

You get water vapor as well from very short trips.

I am absolutely convinced that Boomba will make it work correctly.
They too know that it takes the vacuum to draw the heavier than air liquid portion of any vapor into a catch can.



Dave

 

[dw2b22]

You bring up a good point Dave I had never thought of with a gasoline motor though I have been working around Hydrogen filled Generators for near 37 year and we must maintain a Vacuum on our Oil seal systems used to keep the Hydrogen in the Gen. and that is to keep the hydrogen that gets entrained in the oil from becoming explosive. If either Vac pump fails we have 24 hrs to fix it or we shut down the Turbine/Gen till it is fixed..
I know cool story bro and all that but Dave speak to a good point..
just sayin also I heard Boomba may be making OCC just to ad that in the mix again..
I do however think if you wanted one OCC the pic on post 177 if you take the filter off and run it to the air intake in front of the turbo it would wark and keep most stuff off the valve stems but it would impinge on the turbo blading and could cause erosion over time. Like I have said in the cold north here I was getting more water than oil in me OCC over winter so had to check it everyday to get a feel for it..

D1JL do you think what rodmoe said would provide enough vacuum through the intake? I really don't want to pressurize the catch can with boost

 

[westcoaST]

Mishimoto oil catch cans are made to withstand boost. You can always add a Boomba one-way valve if you are concerned about boost pressure in the can. Dave does not even have hose clamps on his setup and nothing flies off.

 

[D1JL]

Yes,
Only use a good can on a boosted engine.
And as said use a check valve.



Dave

 

[Chris G]

It'll be interesting to see what Boomba comes up with.

 

[dw2b22]

I will rework and post up my results. Boomba looks promising but is there can going to be something similar to mishimoto (double baffled and 50 micron bronze filter ) mishimoto has a lot of r&d that will be hard to duplicate or manufacture in house.

 

[Chris G]

I was more looking forward to Boomba's 'kit' more than anything simply because it will provide everything you need all in one swoop. Even if they were using someone else's can (like Mishimoto), I would buy it just for the sake of it being easy.

 

[dw2b22]

I think it might be to to much tubing. The engine cover almost fits like stock... almost lol

 

[RAAMaudio]

Since I have an Elite Engineering can already modified and in use I could easily swap it to #1 line, it traps quite a bit of oil with just a baffle and mess filter, I was going to add a bronze element to it as well which I an still do.

I have the top Mishimoto can to install on Line 1 so then I would have a dual system but not really add that much weight as the Elite is smaller, etc and I have plenty of room for it.

The EE can does work well, billet, blue anodized aluminum, the new can is black with blue trim, I am going to look at the MM smaller cans for line #2 so it all matches better as I could easily sell the EE can and with so little oil in the #2 line a simpler can is likely all I would need.

Pic before the DIY Mishimoto radiator install.

NOTE: I am not a fan of VTA, just like I ran a big cat on my original DP, a bit to big it seemed, I will we testing one on the EFR build once done.

 

[Mark88FFan]

hi im new to this forum but found u guys while looking into fitting a catch can to my fiesta, im in the UK so i understand there may be some differences (from reading this thread) with the MAF system? Anyway the real reason for this post is to try and clear some of the confusion im having with the way the whole system works. From what i understand the way the PCV valve works and the whole system from the cam cover to the inlet manifold... works on vacuum from the manifold ? as the revs change the vacuum changes? i may be totaly wrong which is why im asking here.. but if thats the case there is only ever going to be negative pressure (vacuum) in the system, so a catch can or pipe could never explode? only crush, in an extreme?

im trying to make up a catch can system but if there is positive pressure in the cans i need to try and find one that can manage it.. and none of the manufactures seem to advertise what the cans can cope with. cheers.

if u vent to atmosphere, there will be nothing to operate the pcv valve? as the manifold isnt connected to the catch tank so therefore no vacuum?


Edit: i may have figure it all out with some searches on google. in a turbocharged system when crusing along with no boost there is vaccum and the pcv valve is open and working as id expect, but when on boost the valve closes, and the system is pressurised (including the catch can) from the maifold up to the closed pcv valve. during boost the second system, from the induction pipe near the filter, draws the pressure from the crank case into the maifold (along with the fresh air from outside via the air filter) i think ive answerd my own question..

 

[MOFiST]

If you have an ST then you've got a turbo compressor which builds boost into the intake manifold. So it's not really correct to think in rpm but rather whether your on boost or not. If your not on boost then the PCV valve will be open to vent into the intake manifold which is in vacuum. If you are on boost then PCV valve will be closed and the crank case will vent into the valve cover where vacuum is present into the turbo air intake (via hose 2 above).

Most people put their catch can between PCV and intake manifold with a check valve to stop boost from the manifold entering the can.

 

[dyn085]

I believe he best idea is to use an oil with low Noac ect. There isn't a way to stop the buildup.

Exactly this. Using a high-quality oil and taking the money otherwise wasted on an OCC setup and placing it towards a custom tune will give a much larger ROI regarding buildup.

 

[Mark88FFan]

that was very helpfull. thanks for the reply. would i be rite to think its impossible to vent to atmosphere on pipe 1 without removing the pcv valve all together, as it would never have a vaccum if u were to block off the manifold.

 

[MOFiST]

Exactly this. Using a high-quality oil and taking the money otherwise wasted on an OCC setup and placing it towards a custom tune will give a much larger ROI regarding buildup.

Who's offering a custom tune to counter build up on the valves?

 

[dyn085]

Who's offering a custom tune to counter build up on the valves?

Um, no. You're right, I wasn't clear that you can't tune away buildup. A custom tune will have your engine running more efficiently based on the octane that your engine actually sees.