Ford recalls 440k vehicles due to fire risk

[STamp]

Has anyone else checked their Vins to see if they cleared the list??
Apparently mine was a pass?
Still might take it to the dealer just to double check.

 

[STAZ15]

Has anyone else checked their Vins to see if they cleared the list??
Apparently mine was a pass?
Still might take it to the dealer just to double check.

I checked mine. My date is October of 2015. I guess I'm in the clear but that doesn't mean I'm not gonna keep an eye on it


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[Alkoran]

I had my car into Ford for a warranty claim today on the blend door actuator. They did a pressure test on the coolant system which had some very specific instructions from head office I guess on how to perform it, it would seem to me that they still don't fully understand the problem and are trying to diagnose using dealers who are performing maintenance. Pressure test came back good, at 25 psi each time, once cold and once warmed up or something they said. He also took a sample of my coolant to hold overnight to see if it would separate into any oil/coolant layers.

The instructions from head office on my printout sheet were to "check coolant weekly"... so I guess I should start billing them for me providing mechanic services since a newer car shouldn't need weekly fluid level checks when being driven normally. I'm calling the dealer I bought it from tomorrow, I've only had it two months and I would think this would fall under lemon law jurisdiction since it has a big drop in resale value at no fault of my own all of a sudden (not to mention being in the shop for warranty work twice, soon to be three times for unrelated issues)

I sincerely wish you luck, because there is no lemon law in Canada like the one on the other side of the border. And sadly, manufacturers are well aware of that too.

 

[jmrtsus]

I spoke to Ford customer relations this morning.

They were really tight lipped, especially when I mentioned the ongoing or new investigation. They didn't mention go into the dealership for this dummy coolant light fix. I did mention that due to sub-par cooling aspect of the oem radiator etc., I replaced it and they said to save receipts of what I did for future reference. Refund my costs. Only 25k on the car currently.

As for information about this recall, whether or not replace the head and/or engine, they wouldn't say, as they had no information to run with. They are, apparently, still gathering information about what to do or how to fix the problem. They said to wait for the letter, which is being mailed out the week of April 18th, for further details etc. which would be available then.

Grrrr!

The recall is under review waiting for the paperwork according to the NHSTA site. There appears to be many, many investigations on all cars. You simply apply online with a complaint. The so called investigation is not shown on the site with the other 200 investigations on the Fiesta from engine stumbled and missed once when starting to go from a green light and numerous other non repeatable issues to serious ones I guess. I did not read them all because most are jokes. As per the recall notification the actual recall has not occurred yet. The letters will be mailed the 27th I think it is and the parts are not available for the light. The NHTSA will review the letter and approve it for mailing as soon as Ford submits it. Ford's position is there is no head problem as any aluminum head that is allowed to run without coolant will crack. In this case they are saying it is the customer's duty to monitor the fluid and take it in from repairs if the fluid leaks or disappears like any other car. The recall is to help prevent a fires in cars not properly monitored. The will also offer free level checks and reimbursement for any repairs they deem was required. Any hope for a new head will be up to the numbers of actual failures if NHTSA calls for it.

 

[zanethan]

The best compromise would be to install dummy lights for all FiST impacted and then replace any heads that crack in the future. Since stage 1 of the recall involves replacing the coolant bottle (I assume to a larger one) and re-plumbing the turbo coolant return line that might help to alleviate the poor flow characteristics of the head. Yes replacing the head is the best option, but at the end of the day Ford is a company that exists to make a profit. If the issues can be satisfactorily fixed without replacing the head I cannot blame them.

For those of you upset about this news causing our cars to depreciate, I'm not sure that's a valid concern. The FiST already had a steep depreciation as it's a niche vehicle. I mean you can get used ones for under $13K in some parts of the country.

 

[erburtt]

I sincerely wish you luck, because there is no lemon law in Canada like the one on the other side of the border. And sadly, manufacturers are well aware of that too.

We have the Canadian Motor Vehicle Arbitration Plan here, which doesn't require some of the weird stipulations the americans need like 3 attempts at a fix, or needing the vehicle to be under 3 years old and under 50,000 km. Ours can be used against new and used vehicles and the limit is 160,000 km and 5 years old

 

[Alkoran]

We have the Canadian Motor Vehicle Arbitration Plan here, which doesn't require some of the weird stipulations the americans need like 3 attempts at a fix, or needing the vehicle to be under 3 years old and under 50,000 km. Ours can be used against new and used vehicles and the limit is 160,000 km and 5 years old

Yes I know that we have that. But this program is entirely financed by the manufacturers themselves. And it's an arbitration process so there is no guarantee that they'll come with the solution you want (and deserve). According to statistics, on 2014 and 2015 only 1 vehicle out of 3 is either bought back or reimbursed. A year ago, we had a woman in Quebec with a Fiat 500 with horrible problems (many electrical, oil leaks etc. etc., more than 60 visits to the dealership for repairs in 2 years, sent 2 formal notices to FCA) the CMVAP never accepted to buy back her car. They said that the car was still under warranty so she should use the warranty (but she was 4 months before the end of it). Finally, after numerous facebook and youtube viral videos (viral for Quebec that is!) about her lemon and shitty FCA/CMVAP policy, it's a different dealers that agreed to buy back her car and give an other model to her.

I don't want to discourage you in any way, just let you know what might be waiting for you. Let us know how to process will be going in your case.

 

[skidro87]

Mine wasn't on the recall but it has been low on coolant to the point I've topped it up.
Went to the dealership and they wanted to charge $150 to check it out... no thanks

 

[Polaren]

The best compromise would be to install dummy lights for all FiST impacted and then replace any heads that crack in the future. Since stage 1 of the recall involves replacing the coolant bottle (I assume to a larger one) and re-plumbing the turbo coolant return line that might help to alleviate the poor flow characteristics of the head. Yes replacing the head is the best option, but at the end of the day Ford is a company that exists to make a profit. If the issues can be satisfactorily fixed without replacing the head I cannot blame them.

I would agree with the first part, if they replace them all even outside of warranty.

If they can fix the coolant flow to mitigate the issue, then fine, but as it stands adding an idiot light isn't going to fix anything.
As SourSkittle already mentioned earlier in the thread, it creates a hotspot for coolant that doesn't move which can cause the the coolant evaporation or in worst case a crack.
Low coolant or not, the problem can present itself. That's the part I'm not a fan of.

 

[zanethan]

I would agree with the first part, if they replace them all even outside of warranty.

If they can fix the coolant flow to mitigate the issue, then fine, but as it stands adding an idiot light isn't going to fix anything.
As SourSkittle already mentioned earlier in the thread, it creates a hotspot for coolant that doesn't move which can cause the the coolant evaporation or in worst case a crack.
Low coolant or not, the problem can present itself. That's the part I'm not a fan of.

Yes but they are apparently doing more than just adding a dummy light. According to this article, (http://www.driven.co.nz/news/news/fire-risk-recall-confirmed-for-kiwi-ford-kugas-and-fiestas/).


?We will implement the recall in two stages,? Ford said.

?At the first stage, dealers will replace the coolant bottle and cap and re-route the turbo coolant return line. The second stage of the recall will involve dealers installing a coolant level sensor system and wiring harness, and will also re-flash the PCM and instrument cluster with updated software.

?The first stage of the recall will be implemented in the second quarter and the second stage in the fourth quarter. Ford will contact customers at each stage, including providing instructions from the owner?s manual on how to check and refill coolant.



The different (and I assume larger) coolant bottle coupled with a differently plumbed turbo coolant return line might alleviate the hotspot issue. I don't currently know how the turbo coolant return line is plumbed, but if it goes directly from the turbo to head rerouting it should drastically help to lower the coolant temps in the head. Now that article is from NZ, but I would think that the same recall would be preformed globally. If it isn't then I can understand all the hostility against Ford but as it stands I'm waiting to see how they resolve this before rushing to any conclusions. I will say that is was crappy of them to continue production knowing there were issues with the head design but I'm waiting to see how they try to resolve it.

 

[DANger_zone]

Are we 100% sure the coolant is getting burnt up in the head? Even though it creates a hot spot if the coolant is being lost elsewere then the head isnt the only problem and may not be the route cause. A car at 25k shouldnt be able to have all of its coolant burnt up by a hot spot in the head. There could be other issues contributing to this. Just saying.

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[erburtt]

Yes I know that we have that. But this program is entirely financed by the manufacturers themselves. And it's an arbitration process so there is no guarantee that they'll come with the solution you want (and deserve). According to statistics, on 2014 and 2015 only 1 vehicle out of 3 is either bought back or reimbursed. A year ago, we had a woman in Quebec with a Fiat 500 with horrible problems (many electrical, oil leaks etc. etc., more than 60 visits to the dealership for repairs in 2 years, sent 2 formal notices to FCA) the CMVAP never accepted to buy back her car. They said that the car was still under warranty so she should use the warranty (but she was 4 months before the end of it). Finally, after numerous facebook and youtube viral videos (viral for Quebec that is!) about her lemon and shitty FCA/CMVAP policy, it's a different dealers that agreed to buy back her car and give an other model to her.

I don't want to discourage you in any way, just let you know what might be waiting for you. Let us know how to process will be going in your case.

Yeah I figured it would probably be a pain to deal with, its nice it doesn't require a lawyer at least though. I'm getting a quote back from my dealer on a trade-in at the moment before I try to go with a more strong armed approach to the situation, for now I've kept my voice at a reasonable level and tried to keep it civil. We will see how that will change if they offer me a ridiculously low amount on the car haha

 

[erburtt]

Yes but they are apparently doing more than just adding a dummy light. According to this article, (http://www.driven.co.nz/news/news/fire-risk-recall-confirmed-for-kiwi-ford-kugas-and-fiestas/).


?We will implement the recall in two stages,? Ford said.

?At the first stage, dealers will replace the coolant bottle and cap and re-route the turbo coolant return line. The second stage of the recall will involve dealers installing a coolant level sensor system and wiring harness, and will also re-flash the PCM and instrument cluster with updated software.

?The first stage of the recall will be implemented in the second quarter and the second stage in the fourth quarter. Ford will contact customers at each stage, including providing instructions from the owner?s manual on how to check and refill coolant..

I'm more irritated with the loss of value for the 2014's now, at least since I've only owned mine for 2 months and now BAM its considered tainted from this and will need an owner willing to regularly check and top off the coolant. That is if you want to resell at any point, I've had other issues making me want to trade it in so I'm a bit biased.

 

[zanethan]

The resale value for the FiST has always been terrible. I highly doubt your 2014's value has been hugely affected. If it has then wait 2 months, the general population has a very short attention span and will COMPLETELY forget about this recall soon enough.

 

[zanethan]

Are we 100% sure the coolant is getting burnt up in the head? Even though it creates a hot spot if the coolant is being lost elsewere then the head isnt the only problem and may not be the route cause. A car at 25k shouldnt be able to have all of its coolant burnt up by a hot spot in the head. There could be other issues contributing to this. Just saying.

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I'm not sure where it's being lost but if the head doesn't allow the hot coolant to flow efficiently enough then it is possible it could super heat it. As soon as the coolant reaches a less pressurized point the coolant could vaporize. I'm also willing to bet that currently the turbo coolant return line flows through the head.

Like I said I'm unfamiliar with how the coolant lines/channels are currently plumbed but if the turbo dumps hot coolant into the head (especially if its before the constricting area) it would compound the poor flow characteristics of the head design and increase the probability of super heating the coolant. If the new return line bypasses the head then it would lower the amount of hot coolant flowing through the head thus lowering the probability that the coolant can get super heated and vaporize.

 

[Khill007]

This is great news! Hopefully they crackdown on Ford and make them fix what they rightfully should. Also, their spokeswoman Elizabeth is a dumb ****, that dummy sensor doesn't fix anything, it still loses coolant.

Do the **stars** represent a word that starts wit a C and ends with a T? If so, I agree wholeheartedly!

 

[Bretley]

Do the **stars** represent a word that starts wit a C and ends with a T? If so, I agree wholeheartedly!

Haha yea i actually typed the word but i guess some words are moderated and come up as stars.

 

[GAbOS]

The BMW forums I cruise replace the letters with 'waffles' so it would have shown as..


..is a dumb waffleswaffleswaffleswaffles. I can't help but giggle every time.

 

[STamp]

Mine wasn't on the recall but it has been low on coolant to the point I've topped it up.
Went to the dealership and they wanted to charge $150 to check it out... no thanks

No problems though right??
Mine cleared the list as well.

 

[GreenenvyFiST]

Hopefully Ford will fix the real problem. In the meantime my gallon of motorcraft orange came in today from Amazon, and I went ahead and put my level barely above max. I will continue to keep an eye on it, but it doesn't seem to be losing coolant. It was barely below max, and it seems it stayed there pretty consistently.