Necessity of Cooling

[AZST]

I am currently in the process of mapping a preparation route towards a larger turbo for my vehicle. What is everyone's opinion on the necessity of upgraded cooling components, such as a radiator? So far, even on hard mountain driving, I have not seen a coolant temp over 225, and have not noticed any effect of the engine cooling system on performance as so many people seem to have. Is upgraded cooling still a necessary/worthwhile investment, or should I allocate those funds to another area? For what its worth, I am also currently running the stock intercooler, but I will certainly be upgrading to DHM's race intercooler and sanding out the grill. Not sure what effect if any this will have on any temperatures outside of charge air.

 

[OffTheWall503]

A radiator and racing thermostat would be a good place to start, especially with you being in a place like Arizona.

 

[M-Sport fan]

Yes, If I were in Tucson permanently (I went to 'university' there), I would want something even a good deal ABOVE the cooling capacity of the 'go to' Mishimoto radiator, IF there is room for this to even be a possiblity, especially if using the DHM race IC which blocks the radiator even more than any other IC out there (but does let more air in due to the requisite DHM crash bar needed to use said IC being smaller in air blocking area than the factory crash bar).

My guess is that this is even more critical yet if open tracking/lapping/HPDEing in the southwestern heat.

 

[AZST]

Thanks for the responses.
Do you suppose the 160F Mishimoto thermostat temperature is too low for a daily vehicle, or will it work well? I've heard mixed feelings on this.
I'll likely be going with the Mishimoto radiator, as it has been confirmed to fit with the DHM race cooler. Hopefully it will be a sufficient increase in cooling capacity.

 

[M-Sport fan]

If I remember the winter time ambient temps there correctly (it's been over 40 years!), it is warm enough to justify the 160* t-stat year 'round, as long as you do not do ONLY short tripping with it, and get the coolant and oil up to temp on a regular basis.

One question though; WHAT does everyone mean by "shaving" or "sanding" the main grille, is it grinding down the depth of it from the back in order to make the honeycomb 'cells' more shallow to let in more air, or what??
(This is the first time I've ever heard of this being done on any car, anywhere, but I was NOT ever in the import/sport compact 'scene', so maybe it's all the rage there?)

 

[AZST]

If I remember the winter time ambient temps there correctly (it's been over 40 years!), it is warm enough to justify the 160* t-stat year 'round, as long as you do not do ONLY short tripping with it, and get the coolant and oil up to temp on a regular basis.

One question though; WHAT does everyone mean by "shaving" or "sanding" the main grille, is it grinding down the depth of it from the back in order to make the honeycomb 'cells' more shallow to let in more air, or what??
(This is the first time I've ever heard of this being done on any car, anywhere, but I was NOT ever in the import/sport compact 'scene', so maybe it's all the rage there?)

Thanks for the info, I will definitely consider the thermostat. The car has a plastic blocking plate on the lower half of the grill; the idea is to remove the solid plastic by sanding to the point where only the honeycombs remain, thus allowing more air flow into the front of the car.

 

[M-Sport fan]

OK, thanks!

(I STILL don't have the car yet, so I could not know this unless someone told me about it. Ford <- )

 

[mercdank]

Living in Florida, I went with the Mishimoto oil cooler with the non-thermostatic sandwich plate.

 

[2Hemis]

If I'm seeing ambient above 100F on some summer days, should I be going for an aftermarket radiator like the Mishimoto if theoretically I might only go to 5-8 track events a year?

 

[WhiteFords]

If I'm seeing ambient above 100F on some summer days, should I be going for an aftermarket radiator like the Mishimoto if theoretically I might only go to 5-8 track events a year?

Yes, if you intend on open tracking on 100 degree ambient days, the stock cooling system will not be able to keep up. I was hitting a coolant temp 246 degrees (via my AP3) after 10 minutes, and having to back off for half a lap to let go it down. I forgot my temp gun, that blazing hot day at THill West, so I have no idea what kind of brake temps I had.

My decision was to not go back to THill in the middle of summer. When doing track days under 80 degrees ambient, I have much lower coolant temps on track. So the stock cooling system will remain, as I have no faith in a Chinese made radiator option.

 

[M-Sport fan]

as I have no faith in a Chinese made radiator option.

I get HEAVILY criticized on here for saying this same exact thing, but I STILL feel this way, and COA DOES matter when the price for the Sino made part is the same as (or even more than in some cases) a lot of the U.S. made options for other cars out there.

Are all of you tuning/aftermarket performance radiator companies out there listening??

 

[frankiefiesta]

I agree, Mishimoto sucks.. need moar America

 

[AZST]

Are you suggesting that, regardless of potential benefits, relying on Mishimoto's radiator assembly would be unwise?

 

[Intuit]

Thanks for the responses.
Do you suppose the 160F Mishimoto thermostat temperature is too low for a daily vehicle, or will it work well? I've heard mixed feelings on this.
I'll likely be going with the Mishimoto radiator, as it has been confirmed to fit with the DHM race cooler. Hopefully it will be a sufficient increase in cooling capacity.

Based on experiences with my old car, if you put a cold thermostat in, the thing you may have to deal with over the long term, is catalytic converter restriction and water in the exhaust system. Emissions and a small mileage penalty aside, everything else is a positive; from power generation to durability. We see single digit temps annually so obviously heat and defrost becomes an issue. It would also dip in/out of Open Loop engine management mode as you got moving, sending more airflow over the radiator.

The old car has a 167?F open temp.

OK, thanks!

(I STILL don't have the car yet, so I could not know this unless someone told me about it. Ford <- )

The engineers could have a number of reasons for the block in the grill, ranging from license plate mounting to eliminating a source of noise generation to reducing turbulence and streamlining the airflow. Since we haven't asked them we can only guess. Looking at the A/C condenser behind the much more restrictive grill on my 20+ year old car, the block may help keep a lot of tiny rocks and road debris from slowly dinging up the condenser during daily driving. Remember, it's not meant to be a dedicated racing machine. Engineers usually have good reasons for something such as that. Maybe it was done for more stable temperature control under *average* driving conditions....

 

[M-Sport fan]

^^^I was NOT indicating that I was angry at, nor disappointed with, the Ford engineers for anything (including the grille block) they did , but I was angry at Ford in general for taking over 4 months to build/ship a small, somewhat simple car like a FiST to their customers who ordered one.

Especially since I get shit from some on here for even posting on this site, when I do not even have the car yet.

 

[koozy]

so much misinformation on the forum lately, but let's clear up the fact that the grill "block" doesn't block the heat exchangers with the stock bumper. the grill only covers up the unsightly stock bumper from being seen.

 

[M-Sport fan]

so much misinformation on the forum lately, but let's clear up the fact that the grill "block" doesn't block the heat exchangers with the stock bumper. the grill only covers up the unsightly stock bumper from being seen.

OK, thanks!

So, then NO need/purpose for 'shaving'/sanding this grille block whatsoever if not going to a DHM crash bar??

 

[koozy]

not unless they want to show off their stock bumper.

 

[Intuit]

so much misinformation on the forum lately, but let's clear up the fact that the grill "block" doesn't block the heat exchangers with the stock bumper. the grill only covers up the unsightly stock bumper from being seen.

I think the point the person was making was that it reduced airflow; suggesting that it be shaved to improve cooling.

It makes sense that it's purpose is aesthetic.

 

[koozy]

I think the point the person was making was that it reduced airflow; suggesting that it be shaved to improve cooling.

It makes sense that it's purpose is aesthetic.

that's fair, but collaboratively as a whole repeating things (not just this) all over the forum on multiple threads doesn't make it correct. if it's a duck, it's a duck. saying it's dog doesn't make it dog no matter how many times one says it, except in ones imagination and skewed belief.