Well said. They've already told me they'd do exactly what you just said. I didn't hesitate to go with them again for my FMIC and hot/cold piping, and I'm glad I did. Fitment was perfect, and performance has been great. I'm in no way a Mishi fan boy, but have no issues with them as a company at all. When they screw up, they make it right.
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2016 intake owners with P144C issues please chime in
- Thread starter OffTheWall503
- Start date
As the unpaid guinea pig you're referencing... I want to ask you an honest question, and I'm not trying to be a jerk. What do you do for a living?
The reason I ask is because my job is to to design equipment for my company to prevent exactly what happened with the 2016 intake. (I'd even be happy to build a leak tester for them if they wanted it at cost, since I could just recycle an existing design) I'm pretty sure the budget I get to spend on just a few of our assembly lines beats Mishimoto's yearly gross income. The toys required for perfect production right out of the gate are not cheap. Outsourcing brings even more complications, but allows for a cheaper price in the end. They tested it the best they could with their shop car. How many shop cars do you expect them to keep around? How much are you willing to pay for the extra testing? I really hope I wasn't overly rude, but just wanted you to understand just what an expensive nightmare it can be to bring a new product to market.
The reason I ask is because my job is to to design equipment for my company to prevent exactly what happened with the 2016 intake. (I'd even be happy to build a leak tester for them if they wanted it at cost, since I could just recycle an existing design) I'm pretty sure the budget I get to spend on just a few of our assembly lines beats Mishimoto's yearly gross income. The toys required for perfect production right out of the gate are not cheap. Outsourcing brings even more complications, but allows for a cheaper price in the end. They tested it the best they could with their shop car. How many shop cars do you expect them to keep around? How much are you willing to pay for the extra testing? I really hope I wasn't overly rude, but just wanted you to understand just what an expensive nightmare it can be to bring a new product to market.
I am retired now, my wife and I owned 4 businesses. My main profession was Electronics Maintenance Training course development and training. My customers were AT&T, Lockheed, USN, Exxon, Mobil, U.S Merchant Marine Academy, U.S. Dept. H.U.D., Military Sealift Command and too many others to list.
As to the device Mishi sold all indications are they bought substandard parts, did no QC on them prior to selling them nor any real testing. And testing is easy......offer a number of car owners the opportunity to install and test the device. That was the same way I tested new amp designs. They would have had hundreds of volunteers. One of my businesses was building custom tube type audio amps, both Home Audio and Guitar amps. Every single part, resistors, tubes, capacitors, transformers and other devices utilized were tested prior to use in construction and the units were burnt in and retested prior to delivery. So I know a little about manufacturing. I know we attempted to have two products made for us in "SE Asia"....one of which was silicone tubing. When 7 companies submitted products for testing only two companies even used the specified type of silicone and would have ended up melting in a $2000 amp! I know a lot about troubleshooting electronics, pneumatics and cooling systems and spent 25 years of developing training programs and teaching of Electronics Technicians, Marine Engineers, Instrument Technicians and PC Technicians.
When a business purchases materials without doing any QC tells me they are total idiots. My Jewelry store even tested all gemstones and gold content on mountings and chains. Many times we were able to detect fraudulent gemstones and once had products marked 14K gold that tested at 9K. Our reputation was based on products produced from outsourced parts. If my companies delivered products like this and I did not test them I would have been quickly out of business or in some cases like low gold content in jail! In my years I have rejected many parts purchases and usually refused to do business with that company again, just like I will treat Mishi. If it was just this intake that would be one thing but from other forum members experiences this is SOP for Mishi in their past experiments. They are an absolute joke on this device.....3 connectors and a check valve........how many months and they have not resolved it? Are they really that ignorant or more likely just don't care? Either way I am done with them other than to spread the word to stay away from their new products unless you want to be taken for a ride.
You seem to believe this is a small garage shop that deserves sympathy..........see the quotes below. They sell to others than us forum members. Do you think Pep Boys would put up with this kind of stuff. Now, the truth of the matter is they dreamed up a plan, sold the "dream", outsourced the whole device to "Southeast Asia" then stuck it on a car and pronounced it ready for delivery....AFTER missing promised ship dates. Now WE are dealing with their total lack of business sense and very bad customer relations. Again....they are business idiots. They claim to be engineers.....how many Mishi Engineers does it take to use a micrometer and measure a fitting? Answer....more that Mishi has obviously. I am sure most people understand that parts like this are built to a standard tolerance of min/max sizes. It is fairly obvious that some were smaller than normal. It boils down to the problem is in "Southeast Asia" and my experience is they will do nothing to fix it. Mishi need to get off their butts and take responsibility for a poor product, purchase a higher quality part and fix the problem. Dealing with SE Asia only works well when you have your people over there to observe and test. Most people know the lowest bid is usually the lowest for a reason, quality! No reputable company continues selling known defective products (other than VW)....there is ZERO defence for their actions. Considering ALL of their products are sourced in "Southeast Asia" explains the poor quality.
Your list of mods show you use Mishi and other companies for equipment. Have you seen this kind of problem for the other suppliers? I have used 5 suppliers and only Mishi has delivered a defective product. Am I too hard on them? No, you are too easy on them. When people defend poor business practices it encourages more poor performance by those businesses. On the other hand if they get flamed enough on these forums they will be forced to either withdraw from the market or improve quality and customer relations. It is all about accountability in this world in both personal and business relationships. I ask you, if your company put out junk like this how long would they stay in business?
Quotes
?We haven?t finalized our lease, but the new facility will be an extension to our existing 17,000-square-foot facility at Boulden Interchange Park,? said Mike Sullivan, president of the 10-year-old New Castle company that owns the Mishimoto Automotive brand sold in Pep Boys, speed shops and online retailers, like Amazon.
?Right now, our engineers, [support] and sales team are located in Delaware, but our manufacturing is outsourced overseas to Southeast Asia,? Sullivan said. ?This short-run facility will allow us to take a step toward doing full manufacturing in the state of Delaware.?
http://www.delawareonline.com/story...new-manufacturing-plants-new-castle/30751969/
Not your mom and pop store.......maybe they should pony up a grand or two for new connectors and ship them out!
Wrench on! And also....nothing personal here. Being a "boomer" I have a very low tolerance for poor performance and poor customer relations. Years ago I taught a course for marketing engineers called "Customer Satisfaction Skills" produced by Xerox corporation. They could use it quickly.
As to the device Mishi sold all indications are they bought substandard parts, did no QC on them prior to selling them nor any real testing. And testing is easy......offer a number of car owners the opportunity to install and test the device. That was the same way I tested new amp designs. They would have had hundreds of volunteers. One of my businesses was building custom tube type audio amps, both Home Audio and Guitar amps. Every single part, resistors, tubes, capacitors, transformers and other devices utilized were tested prior to use in construction and the units were burnt in and retested prior to delivery. So I know a little about manufacturing. I know we attempted to have two products made for us in "SE Asia"....one of which was silicone tubing. When 7 companies submitted products for testing only two companies even used the specified type of silicone and would have ended up melting in a $2000 amp! I know a lot about troubleshooting electronics, pneumatics and cooling systems and spent 25 years of developing training programs and teaching of Electronics Technicians, Marine Engineers, Instrument Technicians and PC Technicians.
When a business purchases materials without doing any QC tells me they are total idiots. My Jewelry store even tested all gemstones and gold content on mountings and chains. Many times we were able to detect fraudulent gemstones and once had products marked 14K gold that tested at 9K. Our reputation was based on products produced from outsourced parts. If my companies delivered products like this and I did not test them I would have been quickly out of business or in some cases like low gold content in jail! In my years I have rejected many parts purchases and usually refused to do business with that company again, just like I will treat Mishi. If it was just this intake that would be one thing but from other forum members experiences this is SOP for Mishi in their past experiments. They are an absolute joke on this device.....3 connectors and a check valve........how many months and they have not resolved it? Are they really that ignorant or more likely just don't care? Either way I am done with them other than to spread the word to stay away from their new products unless you want to be taken for a ride.
You seem to believe this is a small garage shop that deserves sympathy..........see the quotes below. They sell to others than us forum members. Do you think Pep Boys would put up with this kind of stuff. Now, the truth of the matter is they dreamed up a plan, sold the "dream", outsourced the whole device to "Southeast Asia" then stuck it on a car and pronounced it ready for delivery....AFTER missing promised ship dates. Now WE are dealing with their total lack of business sense and very bad customer relations. Again....they are business idiots. They claim to be engineers.....how many Mishi Engineers does it take to use a micrometer and measure a fitting? Answer....more that Mishi has obviously. I am sure most people understand that parts like this are built to a standard tolerance of min/max sizes. It is fairly obvious that some were smaller than normal. It boils down to the problem is in "Southeast Asia" and my experience is they will do nothing to fix it. Mishi need to get off their butts and take responsibility for a poor product, purchase a higher quality part and fix the problem. Dealing with SE Asia only works well when you have your people over there to observe and test. Most people know the lowest bid is usually the lowest for a reason, quality! No reputable company continues selling known defective products (other than VW)....there is ZERO defence for their actions. Considering ALL of their products are sourced in "Southeast Asia" explains the poor quality.
Your list of mods show you use Mishi and other companies for equipment. Have you seen this kind of problem for the other suppliers? I have used 5 suppliers and only Mishi has delivered a defective product. Am I too hard on them? No, you are too easy on them. When people defend poor business practices it encourages more poor performance by those businesses. On the other hand if they get flamed enough on these forums they will be forced to either withdraw from the market or improve quality and customer relations. It is all about accountability in this world in both personal and business relationships. I ask you, if your company put out junk like this how long would they stay in business?
Quotes
?We haven?t finalized our lease, but the new facility will be an extension to our existing 17,000-square-foot facility at Boulden Interchange Park,? said Mike Sullivan, president of the 10-year-old New Castle company that owns the Mishimoto Automotive brand sold in Pep Boys, speed shops and online retailers, like Amazon.
?Right now, our engineers, [support] and sales team are located in Delaware, but our manufacturing is outsourced overseas to Southeast Asia,? Sullivan said. ?This short-run facility will allow us to take a step toward doing full manufacturing in the state of Delaware.?
http://www.delawareonline.com/story...new-manufacturing-plants-new-castle/30751969/
Not your mom and pop store.......maybe they should pony up a grand or two for new connectors and ship them out!
Wrench on! And also....nothing personal here. Being a "boomer" I have a very low tolerance for poor performance and poor customer relations. Years ago I taught a course for marketing engineers called "Customer Satisfaction Skills" produced by Xerox corporation. They could use it quickly.
Just chiming in here to say that mine hasn't thrown a code yet, but it only gets driven once or twice a week so there's always a chance it just hasn't had enough time to throw yet.
That being said, I 100% agree with the above post. We knew there would be a problem before these even shipped because the full intake got released a few weeks earlier and immediately started throwing codes.
I think the absolute best option is to offer a small number of the new part to those willing to pay ahead of time to test it out. I would imagine a number of forum members would be more than willing to be test subjects if it meant a 10% discount or just the opportunity to try the product before everyone else.
Either way, Mishimoto is not doing themselves any favors in terms of their reputation. The folks on Reddit absolutely bury them, and it sure looks like these forums are catching up on that lack of confidence. And that's a shame honestly, because this is my first part from them and I've really liked it thus far. We could use a company like them on our side if they could work out these issues.
That being said, I 100% agree with the above post. We knew there would be a problem before these even shipped because the full intake got released a few weeks earlier and immediately started throwing codes.
I think the absolute best option is to offer a small number of the new part to those willing to pay ahead of time to test it out. I would imagine a number of forum members would be more than willing to be test subjects if it meant a 10% discount or just the opportunity to try the product before everyone else.
Either way, Mishimoto is not doing themselves any favors in terms of their reputation. The folks on Reddit absolutely bury them, and it sure looks like these forums are catching up on that lack of confidence. And that's a shame honestly, because this is my first part from them and I've really liked it thus far. We could use a company like them on our side if they could work out these issues.
Hey guys,
I understand everyone?s concerns and frustrations. Please know that we are doing what we can to figure this out for everyone. While this is not an issue that is affecting a majority of those with either our intake or induction hose for the 2016 Fiesta ST's, the small percentage (~6%) that is affected by it is something that we clearly cannot, and will not ignore. Several of these people are currently working with who have been helping us try different fixes and changes to components of the check valve and other parts. It takes time to test these things. Doing this remotely through PMs and email is not easy and we are doing our best to get this resolved. The folks helping us out are greatly appreciated; you guys are a huge help to us!
There was extensive QC done here, but over this time, we have learned that these Fiesta ST's are very sensitive to the slightest change (we're talking fractions of a millimeter) in components directly related to emissions vacuum pressure. For those experiencing the issue, the method of taping up the CNC port to bump the OD sizing up is doing the trick, so I have just gotten one of our product managers to order a small batch of re-sized CNC fittings so we can send them out to those having this evap code issue. If we find that this provides a permanent solution to the problem, we?ll be swapping out that part for all future shipments of this product. I hope this helps!
-Diamaan
I understand everyone?s concerns and frustrations. Please know that we are doing what we can to figure this out for everyone. While this is not an issue that is affecting a majority of those with either our intake or induction hose for the 2016 Fiesta ST's, the small percentage (~6%) that is affected by it is something that we clearly cannot, and will not ignore. Several of these people are currently working with who have been helping us try different fixes and changes to components of the check valve and other parts. It takes time to test these things. Doing this remotely through PMs and email is not easy and we are doing our best to get this resolved. The folks helping us out are greatly appreciated; you guys are a huge help to us!
There was extensive QC done here, but over this time, we have learned that these Fiesta ST's are very sensitive to the slightest change (we're talking fractions of a millimeter) in components directly related to emissions vacuum pressure. For those experiencing the issue, the method of taping up the CNC port to bump the OD sizing up is doing the trick, so I have just gotten one of our product managers to order a small batch of re-sized CNC fittings so we can send them out to those having this evap code issue. If we find that this provides a permanent solution to the problem, we?ll be swapping out that part for all future shipments of this product. I hope this helps!
-Diamaan
Well after taping the fitting in question and happily figuring the problem code would not surface I was proved wrong after a couple hundred miles. Now I have taped the main fitting which seems to have loosened up, reset the code and will try again. Hope that fixes it, seems these fitting must be air tight or else .....
Hoping for a permanent solution soon. Love the way the car runs so I really don't want to have to pull this off.
Hoping for a permanent solution soon. Love the way the car runs so I really don't want to have to pull this off.
Thanks for the information!
Yes we are leaning heavily towards the car being sensitive to the tolerances allowed for this fitting. We have a batch of an updated fitting size on its way to our headquarters. We will be able to send out a few of them to those of you having a code issue ASAP. Stay tuned!
Yes we are leaning heavily towards the car being sensitive to the tolerances allowed for this fitting. We have a batch of an updated fitting size on its way to our headquarters. We will be able to send out a few of them to those of you having a code issue ASAP. Stay tuned!
Sending you a PM!
Absolutely guys. We have a small batch coming, which should cover those of you who have had codes thrown due to this. Once they get here, this thread will be updated with information on how we will plan to send these out.
The adapter piece is a direct swap for the OEM part. There are no modifications necessary when installing it.
Absolutely guys. We have a small batch coming, which should cover those of you who have had codes thrown due to this. Once they get here, this thread will be updated with information on how we will plan to send these out.
The adapter piece is a direct swap for the OEM part. There are no modifications necessary when installing it.
Yikes. That sucks. Although I've been code free ever since the first tape job, I get nervous every time I've had to remove and reinstall the thing. Then I was really on edge when I put a Boomba OCC in because it pushes up ever so slightly on the adapter. It was all good though.
FYI, no need to wait to find out if the second patch fixed your issue. Even without a CEL, an AccessPort or any decent code reader will show the same code as "pending" within minutes if you're still leaking air.
FYI, no need to wait to find out if the second patch fixed your issue. Even without a CEL, an AccessPort or any decent code reader will show the same code as "pending" within minutes if you're still leaking air.
Yup, the AP3 showed no codes. Prior to taping up the 2nd fitting, my Aerospace Interceptor OBD II gauge did show a "pending" code when I looked for it. No CEL ever came on per se. After taping the 2nd fitting, I switched over to AP3 reading and no "pending" code...thus far. It has been several hundred miles now.
Hey guys, first and foremost, I want to thank all of you for your patience and understanding as we worked to resolve this issue.
Now on to the great news! Our first batch of the resized fittings have arrived and we are ready to send them out ASAP.
If you are running our induction hose or performance intake with the new adapter and have gotten an evap code on your 2016+ Fiesta ST, please send us a PM on here or contact our CS team at support@mishimoto.com at your earliest convenience so we can get your shipping information to have one of these fittings sent out to you. To start, we have a limited amount that we can send, so for now we'd only like to send these to those who have actually had codes thrown. Based on the amount of people who have contacted us for that, we should have you all covered. Looking forward to hearing from you all!
Now on to the great news! Our first batch of the resized fittings have arrived and we are ready to send them out ASAP.
If you are running our induction hose or performance intake with the new adapter and have gotten an evap code on your 2016+ Fiesta ST, please send us a PM on here or contact our CS team at support@mishimoto.com at your earliest convenience so we can get your shipping information to have one of these fittings sent out to you. To start, we have a limited amount that we can send, so for now we'd only like to send these to those who have actually had codes thrown. Based on the amount of people who have contacted us for that, we should have you all covered. Looking forward to hearing from you all!
Great to hear this. Just an FYI, some of us also needed to tape up the other fitting as well, and just not the one going into the induction hose to prevent the recurrence of the code.
Hey guys, first and foremost, I want to thank all of you for your patience and understanding as we worked to resolve this issue.
Now on to the great news! Our first batch of the resized fittings have arrived and we are ready to send them out ASAP.
If you are running our induction hose or performance intake with the new adapter and have gotten an evap code on your 2016+ Fiesta ST, please send us a PM on here or contact our CS team at support@mishimoto.com at your earliest convenience so we can get your shipping information to have one of these fittings sent out to you. To start, we have a limited amount that we can send, so for now we'd only like to send these to those who have actually had codes thrown. Based on the amount of people who have contacted us for that, we should have you all covered. Looking forward to hearing from you all!
Now on to the great news! Our first batch of the resized fittings have arrived and we are ready to send them out ASAP.
If you are running our induction hose or performance intake with the new adapter and have gotten an evap code on your 2016+ Fiesta ST, please send us a PM on here or contact our CS team at support@mishimoto.com at your earliest convenience so we can get your shipping information to have one of these fittings sent out to you. To start, we have a limited amount that we can send, so for now we'd only like to send these to those who have actually had codes thrown. Based on the amount of people who have contacted us for that, we should have you all covered. Looking forward to hearing from you all!
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