That's how I feel... Because the boost holds it doesn't feel like the party is over at 5k anymore. It also makes the car feel more like an NA car because there's no jerky surging. I can't wait till someone posts a before and after with the dyno so we can see how much this extends power across the band.
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TUNE+ Upgraded Wastegate Actuator (Surge Cure)
- Thread starter Tune+
- Start date
I checked with Levitown Ford on the exhaust heat shield and the bolts. All the bolts are the same size, since they're the same part number.
I plan on trimming mine, so I'll store the Levitown one.
Order Content
Part Number
Part Name
Price
Quantity
Total
BM5Z-9N454-B
HEAT SHIELD
$17.33
(Not Taxable)
1
$17.33
-W717392-S300
HEAT SHIELD BOLT
$0.57
(Not Taxable)
3
$1.71
Subtotal:
$19.04
Shipping (FedEx Ground):
$15.20
Total:
$34.24
I plan on trimming mine, so I'll store the Levitown one.
Order Content
Part Number
Part Name
Price
Quantity
Total
BM5Z-9N454-B
HEAT SHIELD
$17.33
(Not Taxable)
1
$17.33
-W717392-S300
HEAT SHIELD BOLT
$0.57
(Not Taxable)
3
$1.71
Subtotal:
$19.04
Shipping (FedEx Ground):
$15.20
Total:
$34.24
So, I've been watching this thread and I have noticed a lack of datalogs posted; at least searchably anyways. 35 pages can be a lot to sift through. Anyways, I see a lot of praise here for people saying the car is better for this because it holds pressure all the way past redline and from the few logs I could find (I found one from JPGC) I took notice that the Y Factor on the WGDC seems to spike noticeably late in the rev range (which means the stock turbo model is blowing up because that level of airflow is outside of the range of the oem turbine) and the WGDC Actual % seems to do this weird nosedive around 3,000. Anyone know why this is? On typical tunes, such as Cobb OTS for example, the WGDC Actual % is in the 60s and 70s. Is Adam just deviating from using the Cobb WGDC strategies? I don't understand. I mean that's why Cobb made it, right?
I would like to see what the STFT strategy also looks like for this. I imagine there's a lot of compensation up top for this number and that it's expecting more air and it just isn't there as the RPMs climb.
As far as I know, Stratified also did extensive testing on one of these applications for the Focus ST not too long ago and the Actuator was deemed dangerous to long term reliability of the stock turbo and risked the car becoming excessively knock prone, ESPECIALLY on pump gas (91 or 93 octane) even with E85 and mild timing adjustments and ESPECIALLY when not done carefully so as not to overdo it. The heat and timing penalty were deemed not worth it.
I know I am new here, but this mod sounds dangerous for the gains being offered, but I'd like to see what everyone's thoughts are counter to this. I'd especially like to hear from Adam on this, though.
You can find the link to the Stratified article on the subject below:
http://stratifiedauto.com/blog/adjusting-and-upgrading-your-wastegate-actuator/
Also, unrelated here, but why does Adam ask for TIP and Load Desired in his logs when he locks those values? Almost seems pointless. He also doesn't ask for STFT, which is strange considering the nature of this modification. I'm very curious what your modifications to the fueling tables are there.
I would like to see what the STFT strategy also looks like for this. I imagine there's a lot of compensation up top for this number and that it's expecting more air and it just isn't there as the RPMs climb.
As far as I know, Stratified also did extensive testing on one of these applications for the Focus ST not too long ago and the Actuator was deemed dangerous to long term reliability of the stock turbo and risked the car becoming excessively knock prone, ESPECIALLY on pump gas (91 or 93 octane) even with E85 and mild timing adjustments and ESPECIALLY when not done carefully so as not to overdo it. The heat and timing penalty were deemed not worth it.
I know I am new here, but this mod sounds dangerous for the gains being offered, but I'd like to see what everyone's thoughts are counter to this. I'd especially like to hear from Adam on this, though.
You can find the link to the Stratified article on the subject below:
http://stratifiedauto.com/blog/adjusting-and-upgrading-your-wastegate-actuator/
Also, unrelated here, but why does Adam ask for TIP and Load Desired in his logs when he locks those values? Almost seems pointless. He also doesn't ask for STFT, which is strange considering the nature of this modification. I'm very curious what your modifications to the fueling tables are there.
One other thing I wanted to touch on here is to ask why we think changing out the Wastegate Actuator will "cure" the surging issue. That does not make sense to me. We have a small turbo, it spools quickly. Quick spooling turbos will be more prone to "surge". This is difficult to avoid, especially when the turbine has a low rotating mass. It spools quickly, but it also stops spooling quickly. I think it would be appropriate to argue that the only true "cure" for this issue is a larger turbine. Stressing out this little one to try to resolve a problem is just fighting physics and the ECU (Which will always follow a specific algorithm) to achieve a result that just isn't feasible. To suggest that simply changing the actuator out for a tighter wastegate will solve this problem does not make sense scientifically. You may get a perceived benefit, but it is not a true solution and it is a high risk; low reward scenario.
As the article said, you have to be very careful around this item so as not to introduce boost spikes and boost creeps, as well as not to harm the reliability of the turbo. Boost control is of the utmost importance. You also need to appropriately modify the fuel tables.
As the article said, you have to be very careful around this item so as not to introduce boost spikes and boost creeps, as well as not to harm the reliability of the turbo. Boost control is of the utmost importance. You also need to appropriately modify the fuel tables.
OP
Thread Starter
#352
Thread Starter
#352
If you don't know why I request tip and load desired then continue to wonder.
I use the OEM wastegate strategies, not Cobb WGDC strategies. Cobb provided their wastegate strategies to simplify it for tuners that don't know how the factory FF system works.
WGDC nosedive at 3k, come on I don't need to explain it to you. I agree that it doesn't need to be there as the turbo is so small but what point are you getting at? You are trying to uncover something you either don't understand or you want me to type out the answer that you already have in your head.
What do you think is happening with STFT that it needs to be monitored? I did all the testing and tuning on my personal car and I know exactly what is happening. If you think the fuel system can't handle the additional boost up top then you don't know where the factory fuel system falls short. Also, if you don't know how the factory quadratic speed density tables work then you might have the wrong understanding about everything that revolves around fueling for these vehicles.
As far as you know? You know for sure that they did testing on it. Ask me how I know. Please, I have no problem disclosing, but you sure do.
Knock prone? Learn how to compensate.
You will still be curious about my "modifications" to the fuel tables after this post.
It was already covered, look for the answer if you truly want to know. You are not a potential customer, so I'm not going so waste too much time replying to your probing. I know who you are.
It has cured surging for 95% of the customers that installed it with the first revision. The other 5% need additional tuning as they aren't an E-tune customer of mine just yet.
Wowzers, I see I've touched a nerve.
You know who I am? Is that some sort of threat?
We're off the technical now. I was trying to promote discussion and get some very serious questions and concerns of mine answered (I had not seen anyone ask them, nor had you offered those answers up front) and you respond to me with accusations, thinly veiled threats, and and flat denial to answer any of my questions simply based on the premise that I have not given you money. That's disgusting. How about instead of hiding behind a paywall and hemorrhaging paranoia about who you THINK I am; you do your business in the open?
I wouldn't give anyone a cent without doing research or asking questions about what I'm buying. I don't think anyone should.
I have offered no accusations towards you. I have not attacked you. I asked you some tough questions sure, but you seem to be afraid to answer them and would rather attack me before that or shake me down for money. That is more concerning than what I can see in your datalogs.
People SHOULD be asking these questions of you. They SHOULD be posting their datalogs for review. You SHOULD be scrutinzed. You SHOULD be explaining yourself and why you're doing the things you are doing. You SHOULD be providing info and educating people interested in what you're doing even though they aren't giving you money right now.
Most of all, you shouldn't go around accusing people of being this or that. It's extremely poor form.
You know who I am? Is that some sort of threat?
We're off the technical now. I was trying to promote discussion and get some very serious questions and concerns of mine answered (I had not seen anyone ask them, nor had you offered those answers up front) and you respond to me with accusations, thinly veiled threats, and and flat denial to answer any of my questions simply based on the premise that I have not given you money. That's disgusting. How about instead of hiding behind a paywall and hemorrhaging paranoia about who you THINK I am; you do your business in the open?
I wouldn't give anyone a cent without doing research or asking questions about what I'm buying. I don't think anyone should.
I have offered no accusations towards you. I have not attacked you. I asked you some tough questions sure, but you seem to be afraid to answer them and would rather attack me before that or shake me down for money. That is more concerning than what I can see in your datalogs.
People SHOULD be asking these questions of you. They SHOULD be posting their datalogs for review. You SHOULD be scrutinzed. You SHOULD be explaining yourself and why you're doing the things you are doing. You SHOULD be providing info and educating people interested in what you're doing even though they aren't giving you money right now.
Most of all, you shouldn't go around accusing people of being this or that. It's extremely poor form.
OP
Thread Starter
#355
Thread Starter
#355
A.) I don't want your money, I clearly stated that you are NOT a potential customer of mine. Anyone that has asked technical data within reason has received clear answers.
B.) Threats? If you took my post as a threat, then you are DEFINITELY not worth my time.
C.) I don't need to explain anything I'm doing when it comes to how I tune. The customers can speak for themselves, and they have. I would say 60% of my customer based have switched from OTHER tuners to me to fix their issues. I must have somewhat of an idea on what I'm doing as nobody else can figure it out. There are a few select vendors on here that are looking to bite off me, that is why I keep my strategies concealed and out of their view.
You went looking for your "answers" the wrong way, and I deemed you unworthy of a proper detailed response.
You have some concerns, but none of your concerns are accurate and me telling you why I do something the way I do, or explaining to you how I "mod my fuel tables" doesn't benefit me in anyway.
B.) Threats? If you took my post as a threat, then you are DEFINITELY not worth my time.
C.) I don't need to explain anything I'm doing when it comes to how I tune. The customers can speak for themselves, and they have. I would say 60% of my customer based have switched from OTHER tuners to me to fix their issues. I must have somewhat of an idea on what I'm doing as nobody else can figure it out. There are a few select vendors on here that are looking to bite off me, that is why I keep my strategies concealed and out of their view.
You went looking for your "answers" the wrong way, and I deemed you unworthy of a proper detailed response.
You have some concerns, but none of your concerns are accurate and me telling you why I do something the way I do, or explaining to you how I "mod my fuel tables" doesn't benefit me in anyway.
![[cool]](/images/smilies/icon_smile_cool.gif "Cool [cool]"){kind=icon}
You're just so far behind the (actual) knowledge curve that it impossible to bring you up to speed in a few forum posts. I recommend you go out and gain your own real-world experience with real hardware and software, then come back and ask a legitimate, answerable question. In fact if you pursue my recommendation and are a reasonably intelligent person, you likely won't have any questions at all.
Another FYI, "Tuning" questions are generally answered as fully as possible without disclosing the tuner's proprietary (learned the hands-on hard way) strategies and specifics. I've asked a legitimate hardware question, received the answer, and purchased the Tune+ WGA.
Another FYI, "Tuning" questions are generally answered as fully as possible without disclosing the tuner's proprietary (learned the hands-on hard way) strategies and specifics. I've asked a legitimate hardware question, received the answer, and purchased the Tune+ WGA.
Dude, you posted two accusatory posts... They weren't tough questions, you came at an angle as to accuse Adam of being a fraud.
Adam doesn't need me sticking up for him but if you pissed in my Wheaties like you did his, I think I would have responded much more in the vulgar than he did.
By the way, Jayrod1980 = Jeff Rodriguez
Adam doesn't need me sticking up for him but if you pissed in my Wheaties like you did his, I think I would have responded much more in the vulgar than he did.
By the way, Jayrod1980 = Jeff Rodriguez
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