Would the 2.0 or 2.3 EB motors fit in the fist?

[MikeyTwins]

I was really hoping that if they did a fiesta rs it would come with the 2.0 EB being that they stepped up a motor size for the focus rs... Looks like I will be disappointed in that department though.

 

[MrClean]

The only two ways using the 2.3T in our cars would be remotely fun would be 1) leaving it stock and just having a great DD powerband which will still smoke your tires off and 2) if you were looking to 1/2mile or mile racing events and you needed the bigger power. While I salivate at the latter prospect (especially after seeing English Racing's 700fwhp Integra going 180+ in the Texas Mile) there would be little to no use for it in our cars in any other aspect. You won't have the traction needed for the 1320, you won't have it in the corners, it will render the car utterly useless outside of the two aforementioned areas.

It really is not a question of can you do it, but rather should you do it.

 

[MikeyTwins]

I still think it would be fine... The srt 4 guys have seem to be doing just fine at those power levels for a long time now... I don't think an extra 80-90 lbs ft would make this car unmanageable.

 

[Hijinx]

I still think it would be fine... The srt 4 guys have seem to be doing just fine at those power levels for a long time now... I don't think an extra 80-90 lbs ft would make this car unmanageable.

Que [MENTION=688]Sourskittle[/MENTION]

I had a friend a long time ago. He had a 425whp SRT-4. It was basically a roller rink, so he only got on it from a roll. Plus, as a street car it's about 500lbs heavier.

 

[FatGuyInALittleCar]

I still think it would be fine... The srt 4 guys have seem to be doing just fine at those power levels for a long time now... I don't think an extra 80-90 lbs ft would make this car unmanageable.

I think you're focusing too much on peak number and not on the effects of the change in power delivery. We can't even hard launch now without some change to the RMM or the motor will slap the firewall. The car heat soaks now... how is a bigger motor creating even more heat going to help that? There's only so much room for turbo and exhaust plumbing between the engine and firewall. Can it be done, sure? But again, the gain is not worth it, the drivability of the car will be ruined (torque steer is not a handling characteristic). Introducing extra weight over the front wheels of a lightweight chassis like ours will destroy handling, not to mention the brakes, steering components, suspension, etc.
While you can't make a 1.6 have the same specific output as a 2.3, you certainly can add (as has been proven time and time and time and time again) useable power to the 1.6 for a lot less coin, get the speed you're looking for and have a lot of coin left over.
But you seem set in your opinion, so go for it. Prove us, (and common sense and physics), wrong.

 

[RAAMaudio]

I am running around 300/300 at the wheels on a 91 octane tune, soon to have the 5th injector with the slightly smaller turbo I will make a bit more WHP and maybe torque but will want the tune to bring in the torque as smoothly as possible and not to much down low in the rev range.

With 225 Rival S tires which are about as stick as you can get for a street tire, LSD, all suspension bushings upgraded, coilovers, etc and setup for road course use, it spools a bit late for my taste and makes the car very difficult on a tight canyon road to really get it on as too slow then way to quick in a sudden change that has to be carefully used.
Last time weighed the car was at 2275lbs, is less now.

Standing start.
1st gear, once I hit boost I am instantly hitting the rev limiter, shift and bogging.
2nd gear, warm out, tires warmed up, hits boost and rockets away, much quicker than it might seem

BUT, huge torque steer, I nearly ran into a car in the next lane when I first found out how bad it was, now I am more prepared but it is not really fun.
3rd gear is better but still has some and at that speed I really do not want to be darting around.
On a canyon run I have to use less of the road to ensure I do not run off the side of it.

A more linear power band will help a great deal but not if I have huge torque anywhere in the lower gears, not unless I was on a drag strip with slicks could I use it.

Again, I have great hopes the GTX2860R will bring the car into a more balanced package as I built the whole car as a unit as I always do, if the GTX does not quite get me where I want to be then I will go a bit smaller, it will have more than enough WHP and torque to make for a very quick car, just need to tame the instant spin at 4,000 RPM in 1st gear and a bit less torque steer in 2nd and I will be set.

Nice thing about a stock engine, cheap at a junk yard if you pop one, which I did in my last two boosted projects, just swap it in and go(unless of course a failure that takes the turbo and coolers out as well)

Engine swaps are cool, I have done them, just have to make sense to me before I would consider it, if the 2.0 was an easy swap it would be what I would do, not the 2.3, simply not needed with the weight of the car.

If there was a reasonable way to make the 1.6 into a 1.8 it might be all one could really want, 2.0 is more than enough I am sure.

Of course do as you will, many here just think it is simply not the best way to go and some of us have done these things or seen many done.

 

[frankiefiesta]

While our engine is plenty good for what the car is I can understand your desire for an engine swap. I got into cars thanks to engine swapped Hondas. If the 2.0/2.3 makes more power than have fun swapping it in. It would make an awesome straight line car.

Saying it's not worth it is similar to saying swapping from a Honda b series to k series isn't worth it. Can you make good power out of the 1.6L? Yes. Can you make a hell of a lot more out of the 2.0/2.3? Yes.

 

[LT Berzerker]

For those inquiring minds... Already been done...

http://passionford.com/forum/restor...-2-0-ecoboost-engine-swap-370lbft-270whp.html

 

[MikeyTwins]

Thanks so much for finding that! That guy seems to love how his 2.0 performs in it! It must be a blast... Most are acting like a 2.0 or 2.3eb is a viper size motor here!

 

[LT Berzerker]

He is also doing a lot of what was suggested in the thread ie: torque limiting until 3rd gear

 

[RAAMaudio]

I went through about 1/3 of the swap link.

If one has the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$, the time, patience, etc....yes, it can be done, at least the frame rails are not an issue.

This is not a swap for the faint hearted or low bucks back yard modder.

After having spent over $100k each on two pretty intense car builds I finally just go sick of working on I parted them out so I am a bit biased towards not taking on a project like this on a modern vehicle.

You could do a custom super charger and turbo setup on the 1.6 for far less cost and trouble or possible find a way to do a sequential turbo though a very tight fit.

 

[LT Berzerker]

Suffice to say your impressed raam lol

 

[RAAMaudio]

I have huge respect for what he and those working on this have done and not even seen the end results, tuning, etc.....

I also have had far to many fun times dealing with "pro" shops not getting things done right or taking forever....I ended up buying all the tools and learning how to DIY all I could but I am a lifelong DIY guy so that part was more fun than pain.

 

[RAAMaudio]

Once a SEMA I saw a PT Cruiser made into a convertible before they were sold, it had a Viper V10 in the back set.

1st thought: WOW!
2nd thought: WHY?

I really do understand the desire to do what others or at least few have done and have been working on not doing that anymore though my FiST was to stay pretty close to stock it is far from it and not even likely to be ever really "done".

Stock, Cyborg, EFR, next up GTX turbo
Stock, CRX, J-Line, DHM race IC
5.3k miles on the car is 19 months

 

[MikeyTwins]

I think you're focusing too much on peak number and not on the effects of the change in power delivery. We can't even hard launch now without some change to the RMM or the motor will slap the firewall. The car heat soaks now... how is a bigger motor creating even more heat going to help that? There's only so much room for turbo and exhaust plumbing between the engine and firewall. Can it be done, sure? But again, the gain is not worth it, the drivability of the car will be ruined (torque steer is not a handling characteristic). Introducing extra weight over the front wheels of a lightweight chassis like ours will destroy handling, not to mention the brakes, steering components, suspension, etc.
While you can't make a 1.6 have the same specific output as a 2.3, you certainly can add (as has been proven time and time and time and time again) useable power to the 1.6 for a lot less coin, get the speed you're looking for and have a lot of coin left over.
But you seem set in your opinion, so go for it. Prove us, (and common sense and physics), wrong.

Looks like someone already did it and loves the outcome... Proving common sense and physics wrong is pretty fun I guess... Once again the weight difference up front between the two motors would not be much at all and we are talking about adding .4-.7 liters of displacement here... Not swapping in a blown lsx engine!

 

[MikeyTwins]

My car is almost brand new with only a few thousand miles on so I won't be ripping out the new 1.6 any time soon... I will be shipping my car to the boys at DHM to work their magic on this little 1.6 and see how I like the end result... If it still falls short of my expectations I will most likely push the motor to its limits and if it happens to blow it will be an excuse to try this project... i have had a 1000+whp on pump gas cobra that I would drive across the country... I had over 100k+ into that car so in the end it's all in good fun... We are all car guys in the end who just want to have fun!✌

 

[PhoenixM3]

I'm still in for a dual engined FiST.

 

[Hijinx]

I'm still in for a dual engined FiST.

600whp of dual engined terror lol.

 

[BrokenSVT]

Another favorite SCC car:

http://www.motorauthority.com/news/...i-tiburon-does-donut-dance-rips-off-10s-video

 

[Dustys318]

I went through about 1/3 of the swap link.

If one has the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$, the time, patience, etc....yes, it can be done, at least the frame rails are not an issue.

This is not a swap for the faint hearted or low bucks back yard modder.

After having spent over $100k each on two pretty intense car builds I finally just go sick of working on I parted them out so I am a bit biased towards not taking on a project like this on a modern vehicle.

You could do a custom super charger and turbo setup on the 1.6 for far less cost and trouble or possible find a way to do a sequential turbo though a very tight fit.

Getting the supercharger from a Mini Cooper (10.5psi) and sequential it with the GTX2867 would be the best of both worlds...