Tune+: Tuning Review and Information Thread

[Tune+]

Math? Eff that. You guys do know I am still keeping the DP right...I feel bad only because I had to put up with such a pain in the ass putting it on. After all the bullshit I have dealt with it I agree fuck the downpipe, but alas I dont have a time machine.

On a different note how much is this wastegate acuator? I have the Friggen turbo sittin on my work bench if its not a million dollars perhaps its a great time to put that on

Price will be $140.00 shipped during pre-order. $155.00 after the first initial run. I will launch the pre-order on my site in about 2-3 days.

 

[McLilySladentine]

NICE! Didn't know you went and got it dyno'd!

Did you happen to get a stock baseline dyno on the same dyno at all to compare? Also, did you happen to log the pull?

No sorry, I didn't do a baseline. I also did not log the pull. I was too excited that the guys at the shop let me put it on the dyno!

 

[white-rhyno]

Price will be $140.00 shipped during pre-order. $155.00 after the first initial run. I will launch the pre-order on my site in about 2-3 days.

What are the advantages to running this?

 

[Tune+]

What are the advantages to running this?

My internal wastegate actuator eliminates part throttle surging, transient boost pikes, and it holds more boost until redline. I will have a full development thread on this during the pre-launch. Here are the dyno results. You can see that this was during the same time as I tested the downpipe and such above (baseline numbers are the same). This is MAP Catback, MAP Intercooler, TUNE+ Actuator, and my E30 tuning.

 

[white-rhyno]

Guess i needs one then, put my name on one please.

 

[frankiefiesta]

Adam, will your IWG actuator be suitable for a cyborg turbo? As you know I'm planning on going that route eventually

 

[C. love]

well [MENTION=3594]white-rhyno[/MENTION] beat to the punch on my next question. good to know what this piece is needed and what it can do.

Back to the downpipe I have always heard the less back pressure and bigger the better exhaust wise on a turbo car, no matter the turbo size. Why does this not hold true on the fiesta?

this article here is what i recall reading. BTW Adam I am not refuting what you're saying just trying to learn a bit here

http://www.tercelreference.com/tercel_info/turbo_exhaust_theory/turbo_exhaust_theory.html

 

[Tune+]

Guess i needs one then, put my name on one please.

You got it!

well [MENTION=3594]white-rhyno[/MENTION] beat to the punch on my next question. good to know what this piece is needed and what it can do.

Back to the downpipe I have always heard the less back pressure and bigger the better exhaust wise on a turbo car, no matter the turbo size. Why does this not hold true on the fiesta?

this article here is what i recall reading. BTW Adam I am not refuting what you're saying just trying to learn a bit here

http://www.tercelreference.com/tercel_info/turbo_exhaust_theory/turbo_exhaust_theory.html

I already explained why above, however if you want more information read my post on the thread I created below when I was still working with MAPerformance.

http://www.fiestastforum.com/forum/...ing-Intake-Downpipe-Exhaust-Turbo-Kit)/page31

Adam, will your IWG actuator be suitable for a cyborg turbo? As you know I'm planning on going that route eventually

Sure will, highly recommended for the cyborg!

 

[frankiefiesta]

Cool, I'll keep an eye out for the pre sale thread

 

[Ext569]

My internal wastegate actuator eliminates part throttle surging, transient boost pikes, and it holds more boost until redline. I will have a full development thread on this during the pre-launch. Here are the dyno results. You can see that this was during the same time as I tested the downpipe and such above (baseline numbers are the same). This is MAP Catback, MAP Intercooler, TUNE+ Actuator, and my E30 tuning.

Adam, in regards to an upgrade path, where would you position this IWG actuator considering that my planned next steps are FMIC + chargepipes? Would the IWG actuator be a positive incremental upgrade to be done first? A sub $200 upgrade is a no-brainer in my book. Or better just to wait until the FMIC is installed. I am no expert, but I can clearly see how you've been able to smoothly increase the progression of HP and TQ delivery.

 

[C. love]

I don't think, I have tested. The problem with the downpipe is that it makes the turbo run out of efficiency faster, so at the power crossover you are are moving less air. I datalogged over 30 parameters to test this theory when I did the development. It is all posted on the forums, and linked a page or two back.

There were also no torque or power gains below the crossover, so personally I don't recommend the downpipe until you get a turbo upgrade. I made 15whp more with the stock downpipe over the MAP downpipe.

This? Still doesnt answer why the Fiesta responds the way it does but many other turbo cars see the opposite effect.

The other thread you posted seems to be a million pages long but has some juicy details. I will peer into this thanks for the time Adam.

 

[Hijinx]

This? Still doesnt answer why the Fiesta responds the way it does but many other turbo cars see the opposite effect.

The other thread you posted seems to be a million pages long but has some juicy details. I will peer into this thanks for the time Adam.

I think what he's trying to convey is that these baby turbos run out of breath too soon with a large downpipe. These little guys spin VERY fast. I was once told exactly how fast, but I can't recall off hand. That larger piping allows it to spin up too far, too quickly and it gets hot enough to be pushed near its limits.

Idk, man. I'm just guessing based on what was said.

While it's hard to believe, I wouldn't be surprised if the aftermarket just up and went with the tried and true 3" downpipe. But, even 2JR found that a reduction down to 2.5 produced more power than a straight 3" pipe. I don't completely doubt the legitimacy of Adams findings. I'd just really like to know the "how" behind it.

 

[C. love]

I think what he's trying to convey is that these baby turbos run out of breath too soon with a large downpipe. These little guys spin VERY fast. I was once told exactly how fast, but I can't recall off hand. That larger piping allows it to spin up too far, too quickly and it gets hot enough to be pushed near its limits.

Idk, man. I'm just guessing based on what was said.

While it's hard to believe, I wouldn't be surprised if the aftermarket just up and went with the tried and true 3" downpipe. But, even 2JR found that a reduction down to 2.5 produced more power than a straight 3" pipe. I don't completely doubt the legitimacy of Adams findings. I'd just really like to know the "how" behind it.

Yes! Thank you. I am not arguing against or for Adam just wanna know the "how" as well. As far as Im concerned screw the downpipe but I still wanna know the "how" of this. Obviosuly its the tiny turbo at play but I like to know the ins and outs.

 

[Tune+]

Adam, in regards to an upgrade path, where would you position this IWG actuator considering that my planned next steps are FMIC + chargepipes? Would the IWG actuator be a positive incremental upgrade to be done first? A sub $200 upgrade is a no-brainer in my book. Or better just to wait until the FMIC is installed. I am no expert, but I can clearly see how you've been able to smoothly increase the progression of HP and TQ delivery.

I personally did it right after I did the tune. This is how I have the upgrade path structured for my customers on my facebook group. www.facebook.com/groups/ecoboostsupport

Tune>Intercooler>Tune+ Internal Wastegate Actuator>Catback>Intake>Chargepipes

You can swap the intake and charge pipes around as the chargepipes are low on HP but help a lot with boost leaks and the charge pipes blowing out.

Honestly, if you are in a area that has rather mild climate (80° and under) you can move the IWG in front of the intercooler. Personally, if it is in the budget, tune/intercooler/iwg should be done all at once.

This? Still doesnt answer why the Fiesta responds the way it does but many other turbo cars see the opposite effect.

The other thread you posted seems to be a million pages long but has some juicy details. I will peer into this thanks for the time Adam.

No problem. I put a lot of details in that thread, it is worth the read.

I think what he's trying to convey is that these baby turbos run out of breath too soon with a large downpipe. These little guys spin VERY fast. I was once told exactly how fast, but I can't recall off hand. That larger piping allows it to spin up too far, too quickly and it gets hot enough to be pushed near its limits.

Idk, man. I'm just guessing based on what was said.

While it's hard to believe, I wouldn't be surprised if the aftermarket just up and went with the tried and true 3" downpipe. But, even 2JR found that a reduction down to 2.5 produced more power than a straight 3" pipe. I don't completely doubt the legitimacy of Adams findings. I'd just really like to know the "how" behind it.

Exactly, let me see if I can break this down a little easier so you don't have to read through a bunch of data. Below is not actual data, but more of a picture to show what my theory is on why the downpipe loses power, or at least doesn't promote it on the stock turbo.

The one thing I noticed was the torque came on a little sooner with the catless downpipe, however it did not reach the same peak. What this tells me is that the efficiency of the turbo was increased, but it had a negative effect as it reached peak exhaust mass earlier in the rpm which allowed for torque to drop sooner. The longer you can maintain torque the higher your HP is going to be at max value (5252rpm). Because HP = (TQ*RPM)/5252 the lower the torque, the lower the horsepower is going to be. When you have a dynograph like the below from my Fiesta, you can see why HP is going to be lower. For smaller turbo vehicles with high VE, it is actually better for you to slow down exhaust mass so the turbo can spin slower to allow a flatter torque curve. The backpressure of the factory downpipe allows for a slower turbo shaft speed. Which, the higher the rpm of the turbo, the hotter the air. The hotter the air, the less dense it is. That is another reason why colder ambient temperatures can produce more power. Density, and detonation prevention which is both based on the temperature of the air.

Dynograph below is turboback exhaust, versus just a catback. They are labeled accordingly. Both are utilizing the Cobb Stage 1 tune to keep the calibration variable the same.

So, the exhaust is just enough additional flow to find the happy medium. I actually disconnected the muffler from the MAPerformance catback and it loss power. I ran open factory downpipe, and it lost EVEN MORE power. So, all test/scenarios gave me more confirmation on my theory about downpipes.

Yes! Thank you. I am not arguing against or for Adam just wanna know the "how" as well. As far as Im concerned screw the downpipe but I still wanna know the "how" of this. Obviosuly its the tiny turbo at play but I like to know the ins and outs.

 

[Tune+]

For everyone that was interested in the wastegate actuator, the pre-order is live!

http://adamtuned.com/collections/2014-ford-fiesta-st/products/tune-upgraded-wastegate-actuator

 

[frankiefiesta]

Already ordered

 

[Kip2MyLou]

For everyone that was interested in the wastegate actuator, the pre-order is live!

http://adamtuned.com/collections/2014-ford-fiesta-st/products/tune-upgraded-wastegate-actuator

So what exactly is this? I'm one who wants a complete plug and play mod with no modifications or anything. Does this check those boxes? And anything to look for after installation? Anything I'll have to monitor or anything like that??

 

[Tune+]

So what exactly is this? I'm one who wants a complete plug and play mod with no modifications or anything. Does this check those boxes? And anything to look for after installation? Anything I'll have to monitor or anything like that??

100% bolt on and go. You will require a small adjustment in the tune, but you are covered. Install, send me a log and enjoy!

 

[Kip2MyLou]

100% bolt on and go. You will require a small adjustment in the tune, but you are covered. Install, send me a log and enjoy!

That's awesome. Might be my next one then. Hmmmm.

 

[Tune+]

That's awesome. Might be my next one then. Hmmmm.

Dooo, it!