Don't Let Oil Temps Stop The Fiesta! Mishimoto Oil Cooler R&D!

[mishimoto1]

I had 3 hours drive this morning from my home to the shop to install oil cooler. On my way there AMB was 60F and my oil temp was up to 217F when I was going 85-90 mph.
After installing Mishimoto Oil Cooler, Mishimoto OCC and replacing oil (AMSOIL Signature 5w20, 4.3 qts + additional 0.65 qts) I had same trip back home with AMB 80F.
Oil temperature quickly reached 216F even when I was driving 75-80 mph. I had few moments of 85+ during which oil temperature jumped 220F.
This was all in 6th gear, not even reaching 4000rpm.

The advertised 35F drop is just that - the advertising, not supported by real testing.
I hope it is effective during track days, where 4000-5000 rpm is a norm.
I have non-thermostatic version.

How did you measure the oil temps?

Interesting, this certainly sounds strange. With a low load driving situation like this, you should definitely see lower oil temperatures. What were you using to monitor temperatures?

My oil Temps never went over 235 degrees on the track when tracking in January. I'll be tracking it this April with both the Oil Cooler and Radiator installed. I'll report back with real numbers and real stress driving. Five 25 minute sessions of 5000-7000 rpm abuse

Looking forward to your results!

-John

 

[bilihor]

How did you measure the oil temps?

always Access Port 3

 

[juliog]

AFAIK, the oil temp displayed by Access Port is a value 'inferred' from other variables, as opposed to actual temp, because this car doesn't come with an oil temp sensor. The only way to monitor oil temperatures is to install an aftermarket sensor and gauge.

 

[mishimoto1]

always Access Port 3

AFAIK, the oil temp displayed by Access Port is a value 'inferred' from other variables, as opposed to actual temp, because this car doesn't come with an oil temp sensor. The only way to monitor oil temperatures is to install an aftermarket sensor and gauge.

Thanks juliog, I believe this is correct. It is likely the display temperature is more related to engine coolant temperature.

-John

 

[ridinVINTAGE]

I just installed mine yesterday and one thing I noticed it is almost impossible to get the proper torque on the fittings coming from the oil cooler. I noticed a leak coming from them due to me not being able to get them torqued enough. Today I rectified that by doing it again. Instead of trying to tighten them while it's installed I removed the hood latch brace and that enables you to pull out the cooler with the hoses attached.

Doing this I was able to torque them down well an it shouldn't leak.

 

[mishimoto1]

I just installed mine yesterday and one thing I noticed it is almost impossible to get the proper torque on the fittings coming from the oil cooler. I noticed a leak coming from them due to me not being able to get them torqued enough. Today I rectified that by doing it again. Instead of trying to tighten them while it's installed I removed the hood latch brace and that enables you to pull out the cooler with the hoses attached.

Doing this I was able to torque them down well an it shouldn't leak.

Great installation tip, thank you! Installing the lines on the cooler prior to installing it on the vehicle ensures the fittings are properly torqued.

-John

 

[dsphil]

I am thinking about installing the oil cooler, but after some research and engineering thoughts, the way this oil cooler mounted with the hoses at the bottom and above the level of the oil pan raise concerns. 1. the oil will drain back into the pan when engine is off. 2. It will take longer for the oil to reach the head and other parts of the engine on starts. 3. It will require more oil to prevent oil starvation, but will over fill when engine is off and during starts. Mounting the hoses at the top may solve some of the issues.

 

[koozy]

All of the oil will not drain back, very little in fact due to the way the hoses are routed. I've had the cooler and familiar with it. And with the thermostatic sandwich the oil cooler doesn't really come into play, oil bypasses the cooler until oil temps have reached ~180F.

 

[dsphil]

Did the hoses route above the cooler?

 

[koozy]

 

[dsphil]

I see. It seems like about 1/2 way. So it will retain that much oil in the cooler.. I don't see the reason why it can not be mount upside down.

 

[mishimoto1]

Hey dsphil

While we have not done any testing with our oil cooler mounted upside down, there really is no reason why you cant. The oil coolers orientation should have little to no effect

Thanks
-Jake

 

[ThaiFiesta]

I am thinking about installing the oil cooler, but after some research and engineering thoughts, the way this oil cooler mounted with the hoses at the bottom and above the level of the oil pan raise concerns. 1. the oil will drain back into the pan when engine is off. 2. It will take longer for the oil to reach the head and other parts of the engine on starts. 3. It will require more oil to prevent oil starvation, but will over fill when engine is off and during starts. Mounting the hoses at the top may solve some of the issues.

I'm interested to understand this more.
I agree with point 1. That way when you do an oil change, old dirty oil is not retained in the cooler.
2. I'm not sure what, if any, differences are included on engines that have this type of oil cooler as OEM equipment. Perhaps Mishimoto can expand on the time difference for oil to flow to the upper galleries with and without cooler. I agree that this would be a major issue if the time is significant.
3. Yes it will require the amount of additional oil equivalent to the volume of the pipes and cooler. This is specified by most reputable manufacturers. I would have thought the manufacturers had considered the possible delay of pressure to the higher parts of the engine on start But perhaps not.
This has made me reconsider this type of oil cooler. I hope more discussion follows. Thanks.

 

[koozy]

- Some are way over thinking this. There's no significant loss of pressure, if at all. The oil pressure idiot light would indicate that upon start up if there was. The FiST is not the only car out there with an aftermarket oil cooler.

- If I wanted to drain the oil from the oil cooler/lines I would have to disconnect the lines from the sandwich adapter to let the old oil that was trapped when doing an oil change. That was the only way to get the old oil out during oil changes, aside from completely removing the entire oil cooler kit.

- Jake, what you're suggesting by mounting the oil lines on the top is not possible currently with the Mishimoto kit without modifications. The lines would interfere with the front radiator cowl as the kit is currently designed. Someone has already done this BTW. You should study up on your own kit/design that you're representing.

 

[dsphil]

Engine wear happens the most on engine start when the oil takes time to reach the head. Stock configuration is the shortest route.
I know that my bmw e30 oil cooler is mounted below or at oil pan level, the lines and cooler always has oil. when the oil thermostat opens to the cooler, oil is immediately available.
Even with the hoses are mounted at top of Mishimoto oil cooler, the oil in the hose will drain back to the pan; and it is a long hose both ways. I don't know if the design does more harm than good in the long term. I just don't know. Imagine if you're revving 5k and the thermostat opens to the oil cooler then suddenly you're short of oil for that few seconds. I think BMW has thought of that decades ago and that is why it still running after 30 years. if not, pure luck.

 

[dsphil]

- Some are way over thinking this. There's no significant loss of pressure, if at all. The oil pressure idiot light would indicate that upon start up if there was. The FiST is not the only car out there with an aftermarket oil cooler..

The believed oil pressure is based on how much oil the pump picks up from the pan. It will loss pressure if there is no or low oil at the pan.

 

[koozy]

The believed oil pressure is based on how much oil the pump picks up from the pan. It will loss pressure if there is no or low oil at the pan.

I can agree with that, and the oil cooler doesn't significantly affect oil pressure loss with the thermostatic sandwich until the oil temp is up to ~180deg F. The sandwich is not completely closed BTW, it still "bleeds" oil through, just not at full range until the thermostat reaches full temp so when it does fully open there isn't a great temp differential between oil in the cooler and oil in the pan. There are OEM cars from the factory with external oil coolers, Porsche and Mitsu Evo's come to mind that operate similarly without issue regardless of the orientation the oil cooler is in.

 

[dsphil]

I can agree with that, and the oil cooler doesn't significantly affect oil pressure loss with the thermostatic sandwich until the oil temp is up to ~180deg F. The sandwich is not completely closed BTW, it still "bleeds" oil through, just not at full range until the thermostat reaches full temp so when it does fully open there isn't a great temp differential between oil in the cooler and oil in the pan. There are OEM cars from the factory with external oil coolers, Porsche and Mitsu Evo's come to mind that operate similarly without issue regardless of the orientation the oil cooler is in.

I understand. I am paranoid.