Considering making an EFR kit to offer, anybody interested?

[RAAMaudio]

Interested in a plug and play EFR 6258 turbo system that should cost less than the other bigger turbo options and get to run the most advanced turbocharge made?

I did not plan to do something this substantial with my newly started retirement/hobby business but I have been looking at all the options for turbo upgrades and the EFR just keeps calling my name. I was a day away from ordering one many months ago but got into the Cyborg as a fun project, I have the first one, it is great but it was not my original goal so it is going up for sale shortly.

Since I want to make my own parts I started thinking once designed I could have more made for others, already talked to the tuner I would use, etc.....I have lots of little parts I am considering but this one would take priority if you guys are interested

Let me know, I can make this a complete package, give you the best deal I could offer, it would have to be GB but 5 units is likely all I would need.

Included would be the manifold to turbo adapter, DP, compressor inlet, outlet if needed, oil lines, and probably the turbo and the tune.

I could offer less complete systems for those wishing so as well as part of the GB requirement.

If not enough interest I will just build my own so all the hard work is done and tested in case others want to go this route later.

No promises for now but I think this might be doable for under $2k (plus down pipe)

Anybody interested in a 2k mile Cyborg let me know as well

Thanks,
Rick

 

[felopr]

Interested in a plug and play EFR 6258 turbo system that should cost less than the other bigger turbo options?

I did not plan to do something this substantial with my newly started retirement/hobby business but I have been looking at all the options for turbo upgrades and the EFR just keeps calling my name. I was a day away from ordering one many months ago but got into the Cyborg as a fun project, I have the first one, it is great but it was not my original goal so it is going up for sale shortly.

Since I want to make my own parts I started thinking once designed I could have more made for others, already talked to the tuner I would use, etc.....I have lots of little parts I am considering but this one would take priority if you guys are interested

Let me know, I can make this a complete package, give you the best deal I could offer, it would have to be GB but 5 units is likely all I would need.

Included would be the manifold to turbo adapter, DP, compressor inlet, outlet if needed, oil lines, and probably the turbo and the tune.

I could offer less complete systems for those wishing so as well as part of the GB requirement.

If not enough interest I will just build my own so all the hard work is done and tested in case others want to go this route later.

No promises for now but I think this might be doable for under $2k

Anybody interested in a 2k mile Cyborg let me know as well

Thanks,
Rick

what would the expected hp and tq target numbers would you imagine it would be?
how would you imagine the curves would look like? (like the stock? like the cyborg? etc)
lag?
boost psi range?

 

[RAAMaudio]

All numbers posted can only be speculation for now but probably pretty close to reality.

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I am still working on some of the info on this with the tuner but I would estimate for now around 300/300, could be a bit lower, a bit higher but fuel becomes an issue in the 300+HP range. From talking to the tuner, he went from a GT to the EFR on a Focus and absolutely loves it, spools far quicker and much more responsive at part throttle. I expect a very nice and wide power band like the cyborg, just more of it and possibly sooner.

He has tuned a GTX on a Fiesta and it did far better than I ever thought it would from looking at the dyno runs on that turbo on the ATP site. He says the EFR will be even better for spooling and response between gears, part throttle, etc...it is why I have decided to go this route instead of just bolting on the GTX or GT2860R and the challenge and fun of making it happen for me, then I thought of sharing it with my fellow enthusiasts if they wish

I just made the decision to do pursue this today and have a wholesale account being setup for the turbos and they can make the DP, adapter, etc as needed though I am working on some parts plans with someone here I may work with or may do this with the tuner if he wants to be a part of it besides just tuning.

I will need a stock car at my place to do the DP design as I have a totally custom full 3" DP and exhaust that connect in a different place. Or just get a stock exhaust, I guess I should not of sold mine!

 

[ian.j]

I am on a bog warner EFR but the kit was not cheap, here is the graph looks like
https://www.dropbox.com/s/50d1ed8a16q5mnc/2014-10-26%2020.26.00.jpg?dl=0

 

[MKVIIST]

Rick, what kind of power did you make with the Cyborg kit? Did you ever get it dynoed?

 

[BoostBumps]

From talking to the tuner, he went from a GT to the EFR on a Focus and absolutely loves it, spools far quicker and much more responsive at part throttle. I expect a very nice and wide power band like the cyborg, just more of it and possibly sooner.

He has tuned a GTX on a Fiesta and it did far better than I ever thought it would from looking at the dyno runs on that turbo on the ATP site. He says the EFR will be even better for spooling and response between gears, part throttle, etc...it is why I have decided to go this route instead of just bolting on the GTX or GT2860R and the challenge and fun of making it happen for me, then I thought of sharing it with my fellow enthusiasts if they wish

Hey this is good to hear... Might be interested if the results are as favorable as this sounds!

Since he has already tuned a GTX on a Fiesta can you provide us with more info and perhaps post some data / results so we can review and make comparisons!?

thanks again!!!

 

[rodmoe]

From what I am hearing on my end is the Fuel system may run out of juice in stock form around 300-350 WHP won;t know till we get there ..
As I have a EFR would be interested in see what comes of this.. cost wise vs power output.. very good..
I think the EFR if you can find one is around $1500ish depending on discounts and if the hardware kit is included ($100 gaskets and Vbands and other parts)

 

[RAAMaudio]

ian.j,

Thanks for the link to the graph, I am going to forward that to the tuner to check out.

Was this tune OTS or custom?

The numbers look much lower than this turbo should be easily capable of, if OTS there should be quite a bit more power available with a custom tune.

------------------
Cyborg,
5200 ft elevation seemed to be causing tuning issues on 91 but when we started tuning on E30 it was apparent it was something else. I cut out the 100 cell 5" cat and it made a huge difference right away, it seems the cat was just to big in diameter causing air flow issues which is something I had never heard of but there was nothing less to test and I was starting my runs at 2500 instead of 2000 RPM which helps the bottom end quite a bit. We barely started the E30 tune when I had to put it on hold for a much delayed road trip so for now the numbers are not that great, 231HP and 258 ft lbs, they will get better and we will have to redo the 91 tune as well. SS has proven the E30 tune can make some pretty good numbers even if just on VD "248 WHP@6400/293 TQ@3900rpm VD, 13.34@104.5mph" I am debating not finishing the tune and just selling it and have arranged for a very good deal on a tune for it for the buyer.

---------------------------

The GTX tune was for his customer so I have asked for permission to post it and will do so if allowed.

-----------------

Thanks

 

[MKVIIST]

Oh ok, I saw you posted the VD numbers before but was waiting on you getting everything done and posted with real dyno numbers. Either way, I like this new project that you are thinking of starting.

 

[ian.j]

its a tweaked OTS Peron map. 1.6 bar of boost, 7300 rev limit. I will be adding my meth install next week.

this is simons running more boost and meth.
http://s88.photobucket.com/user/simonsmail1/media/st377_zps1f7a0ba3.jpg.html

 

[rodmoe]

From what I was thinking/looking at this set up would push the Tq numbers out past 3000 rpm before they start to get as big as we have now but for me on the track i seldom ride around below 3000 prm and with SO much upside on the big end for power all we need to do is make sure it can get enough fuel....

 

[RAAMaudio]

I will be here in AZ for a bit longer than off to CA for awhile so it might be up to a month before I can start this project on my car. I am also going to confer with the tuner about the numbers on the dyno run linked above as they just look to low and late spooling before I start this as well.

Once those are looked at then I will get going on it and when I get going I get things done pretty quickly, most of the time at least

I will have it on a dyno once all tuned up.

 

[rodmoe]

Should be fun to watch
Are you thinking of keeping the factory type brace (the one by the RMM) on the Downpipe to help support the weight of the turbo and reduce stress on the header ? just a thought..

 

[RAAMaudio]

Catching up, I worked late last night, finished plumbing and most of the insulation and sheetrock...

------------------------

I am waiting to hear back from the tuner about the bottom end response, for some like Rodmoe that knows what he wants and needs he can live with how it is, for some that might not be acceptable, I am on that list.

But, with tuning all the parameters available on this engine there may be some great gain in the lower RPM range not yet brought to surface, I sure hope so as I really want to run this turbo and make if available to others interested in it

-------------------------

I was seriously looking at a way to design a very compact tubular manifold, which is not easy to make equal length and firing order sequence, to keep the weight down and aid in response. Seeing the results with a longer runner tubular manifold leads me to believe it is not going to do a great deal even with a tough to design and build shorter runner one, the stock well ported manifold may end up better for the bottom end response.

The tubular one may help on the top end side but we face fuel issues there that have not been addressed by anybody yet other than running wmi which is effective but a pain in the arse to live with. It costs more, more to go wrong, sourcing and mixing it, I have been there and done that and may end up with a system for the track but only as a last resort.

Real world use, even road race track use of 300+ WHP is getting to the point of mostly useless in a FWD with limited tire width, to me at least. I prefer a nice wide power band which is faster in more situations than big top end power so that is my goal for this project. Others wanting more can tune for the max this turbo can do of course.

--------------------------

Good idea on the brace I am sure for long term reliability, thanks for bringing it up, I will work on one that is low in weight as reasonable.

--------------------------

Thanks again for all the great inputs, VERY much appreciated

Rick

 

[ian.j]

here is another peron/ bog warner efr mapped today with afr graph. 291atw
https://www.dropbox.com/s/4fqkzhb8qu79ocq/IMG_325299645582559.jpeg?dl=0

 

[RAAMaudio]

Edited, just got permission on the GTX data VD

I am hoping there is much more down low on the EFR, I cannot go forward on this unless I can get some data logs for the tuner to look at and see where he can make changes to spool it up faster.

At 1.6 bar the EFR is making about the same HP as the GTX but both are capable of much more boost as must of been the case of the second one posted on this thread.

The GTX2860R VD, tuned in just 4 runs by Matt at Panda, 93 Octane

Notice the run started at just under 3000 RPM, it will pick up more torque when starting from 2000 so the lower end on this is looking pretty dang good, far better than I ever imagined it could.

------------

If you can please send some EFR data logs so I can forward them so Matt at Panda can look it over.

Also any other power mods besides the Peron EFR kit would help.

Thanks
Rick



If you can share your logs or get some from the others please do so.

 

[aar0n]

Sub'd for progress

 

[re-rx7]

I'm in

 

[RAAMaudio]

From what I have found so far, still waiting to hear back from Matt about what he may be able to do to get the EFR spooling faster, which has made 330WHP with wmi helping.

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For now I would rather live with "just" 300 up top to have that fat bottom end, in reality it is much more power as it is where I would use it the most and still be very fast on a road race track.

GTX, 220 ft lbs at 3000 rpm will likely be more like 240-250 ft lbs at 3000 rpm if starting the run at at 2000 rpm.

EFR, 200 ft lbs at 3000 rpm starting the run at 2000 rpm(just looking at the last dyno run link, I will look over the others but they all lag quite a bit behind the GTX for now)

 

[RAAMaudio]

OK, this is dead in the water until I can get a data log so it can be looked at to see where we can pick up some power down low with the EFR. I really want to make this happen but cannot move forward until we have something to look at as just to costly and time consuming to invest into this unless we know for sure we can bring up the power down low.

PLEASE, help me find some info to work with.

Thanks,
Rick